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Cant believe this hasnt been talked about

  • Thread starter Thread starter Justaguy
  • Start date Start date
It was brought up, but I think most people felt that McKay kind of got the "just desserts" of his illegal and unethical recruiting practices.
http://www.bradleyfans.com/phpbb/viewtopic.php?p=47771#47771
His team went south and played pretty poorly, even with Danny Granger, and now stinks royally.
He has recruited too many selfish thugs, and has never shown repentence for his blatant recruiting violations when he tampered with BU's best player.
And he was finally dismissed unceremoniously with drastically declining attendance and interest.
Good for Ritchie is he gets a chance to start over.
I am all for it if he gets a second chance.
But please, Ritchie, learn your lesson.
Recruit the good kids out of high school, and build your program with kids you coach, not with other teams' talent.
 
Had McKay been really successful grabbing other teams' players, I'm sure he'd have kept doing it.
In the end he got exactly what everyone else saw coming, but apparently he did not.
 
It was mentioned at the bottom of the coaching carousel thread--
http://www.bradleyfans.com/phpbb/viewtopic.php?t=6468&start=40

I don't think there are many here who "follow" Ritchie McKay. There are many Bradley fans who still harbor resentment toward McKay and Duane Broussard, as they contributed to talking Danny Granger into transferring from Bradley to New Mexico in January, 2003. That was right in the middle of Jim Les' first season as coach, and midway through Granger's sophomore season. Granger's transfer sabotaged that 2002-2003 season and the next 2 for Bradley and Jim Les.

Had there not been such repeated and numerous illegal phone calls from McKay and Broussard, Granger would have likely stayed at Bradley. Granger hadn't shown much in his 1 1/2 seasons at Bradley to that point, and there would not have been another Div I coach that would have taken him then. He would not have left Bradley and sought a transfer if not for McKay.
IMO, Bradley would have had a winning record in Jim Les' first 3 seasons, and pretty good teams in 2003-2004 and 2004-2005 with Granger, Sommerville, etc.
On the other hand, New Mexico would have been awful without Granger. They made it to the NCAA tournament in 2005 (Granger's senior season) with an upset in their MWC tournament (they would likely not have gotten in with an at-large since their RPI was 67 and SOS was 227), then were blown out by Villanova in their only NCAA tournament game. Granger turned out to be McKay's only bright spot in 5 seasons at New Mexico, and Bradley was deprived of much better teams in 2002-2003, 2003-2004, and 2004-2005.
If anything has been proven the last couple years, it is that Ritchie McKay is a poor recruiter and is not a good coach. And that Jim Les is a good recruiter and a good coach.
I don't wish ill will toward McKay and Broussard. I wish them success at Liberty. Good luck trying to steal other schools players to Liberty.
 
I don't get it. What has McKay ever done to deserve getting all these jobs. It's not like he keeps piling up NCAA wins. He only appeared in the NCAA once and was blown out. His teams have mostly underachieved, but he's never been out of work. In fact, he's been one of the highest paid coaches in college basketball.
I wish I knew how he keep fooling people.

looks like he is updating his official website
http://www.coachritchiemckay.com/
 
tornado said:
It was brought up, but I think most people felt that McKay kind of got the "just desserts" of his illegal and unethical recruiting practices.
Click to expand...

And that scumbag Brousard, I hope his next job is at a fast food joint.
 
Da Coach said:
It was mentioned at the bottom of the coaching carousel thread--
http://www.bradleyfans.com/phpbb/viewtopic.php?t=6468&start=40

I don't think there are many here who "follow" Ritchie McKay. There are many Bradley fans who still harbor resentment toward McKay and Duane Broussard, as they contributed to talking Danny Granger into transferring from Bradley to New Mexico in January, 2003. That was right in the middle of Jim Les' first season as coach, and midway through Granger's sophomore season. Granger's transfer sabotaged that 2002-2003 season and the next 2 for Bradley and Jim Les.

Had there not been such repeated and numerous illegal phone calls from McKay and Broussard, Granger would have likely stayed at Bradley. Granger hadn't shown much in his 1 1/2 seasons at Bradley to that point, and there would not have been another Div I coach that would have taken him then. He would not have left Bradley and sought a transfer if not for McKay.
IMO, Bradley would have had a winning record in Jim Les' first 3 seasons, and pretty good teams in 2003-2004 and 2004-2005 with Granger, Sommerville, etc.
On the other hand, New Mexico would have been awful without Granger. They made it to the NCAA tournament in 2005 (Granger's senior season) with an upset in their MWC tournament (they would likely not have gotten in with an at-large since their RPI was 67 and SOS was 227), then were blown out by Villanova in their only NCAA tournament game. Granger turned out to be McKay's only bright spot in 5 seasons at New Mexico, and Bradley was deprived of much better teams in 2002-2003, 2003-2004, and 2004-2005.
If anything has been proven the last couple years, it is that Ritchie McKay is a poor recruiter and is not a good coach. And that Jim Les is a good recruiter and a good coach.
I don't wish ill will toward McKay and Broussard. I wish them success at Liberty. Good luck trying to steal other schools players to Liberty.
Click to expand...

Coach I agree with about everything except the part where Granger hadn't shown much for his 1 1/2 year here....I think he showed plenty otherwise BU fans wouldn't have so much resentment...personally I think that's why Broski was so intent on getting rid of Mo the year before....he BU had a chance to have great year the next year. I think there would have been plenty of D-1 schools take Granger...the only thing that ever held him back was foul trouble. Granger was pretty good from the start IMO.
 
Lefty, I agree that most Bradley fans saw the potential that Danny Granger had. But my point was that in his 1 1/2 seasons at Bradley, what he showed on the court was not enough for other Division I coaches to be lining up to get him to transfer. I will stand by what I said, that if not for all the illegal calls by McKay and Broussard, Granger would have made his peace with Jim Les and stayed at Bradley for 4 years. Instead, when the differences occurred between Les and Granger, it became irreversible because Granger had Broussard talking in his ear on a daily basis encouraging him to split and go to New Mexico.
 
Da Coach said:
Lefty, I agree that most Bradley fans saw the potential that Danny Granger had. But my point was that in his 1 1/2 seasons at Bradley, what he showed on the court was not enough for other Division I coaches to be lining up to get him to transfer. I will stand by what I said, that if not for all the illegal calls by McKay and Broussard, Granger would have made his peace with Jim Les and stayed at Bradley for 4 years. Instead, when the differences occurred between Les and Granger, it became irreversible because Granger had Broussard talking in his ear on a daily basis encouraging him to split and go to New Mexico.
Click to expand...

For as talented as Danny Granger was, BU was 13-30 in his time on the Hilltop. It should be pretty easy to win with a 6'9" NBA talent in the MVC, no matter who is coaching. 2 good BU coaches couldn't. I think that's very telling as to what kind of detriment to the team Danny Granger was.
 
Occassionally, Liberty U. plays some of the local colleges around here. I might just have to show up and give that traitor McKay an earful! :wink:
 
Da Coach said:
Lefty, I agree that most Bradley fans saw the potential that Danny Granger had. But my point was that in his 1 1/2 seasons at Bradley, what he showed on the court was not enough for other Division I coaches to be lining up to get him to transfer. I will stand by what I said, that if not for all the illegal calls by McKay and Broussard, Granger would have made his peace with Jim Les and stayed at Bradley for 4 years. Instead, when the differences occurred between Les and Granger, it became irreversible because Granger had Broussard talking in his ear on a daily basis encouraging him to split and go to New Mexico.
Click to expand...

well i agree about the lining up..but and it's only conjecture now....BU wasn't the only school to see DG's talent...I'm sure other's would have welcomed him to their team.
I also agee it may have been different if no contact between DB and Granger...I also think it may have been different if JL had been more experienced. I think he may have handled things differently too.
 
BradleyBrave said:
Da Coach said:
Lefty, I agree that most Bradley fans saw the potential that Danny Granger had. But my point was that in his 1 1/2 seasons at Bradley, what he showed on the court was not enough for other Division I coaches to be lining up to get him to transfer. I will stand by what I said, that if not for all the illegal calls by McKay and Broussard, Granger would have made his peace with Jim Les and stayed at Bradley for 4 years. Instead, when the differences occurred between Les and Granger, it became irreversible because Granger had Broussard talking in his ear on a daily basis encouraging him to split and go to New Mexico.
Click to expand...

For as talented as Danny Granger was, BU was 13-30 in his time on the Hilltop. It should be pretty easy to win with a 6'9" NBA talent in the MVC, no matter who is coaching. 2 good BU coaches couldn't. I think that's very telling as to what kind of detriment to the team Danny Granger was.
Click to expand...

Well for one thing it was JL's first year...huge learning experience. We had some good players the next year and didn't have great records.
 
Well for one thing it was JL's first year...huge learning experience. We had some good players the next year and didn't have great records.
Click to expand...

We have seen this debated before. And this may be the last time I try to defend Jim Les, since his record now speaks for itself.
There have been extremely few successful coaches who have had winning teams in their first few years, unless they are fortunate to take over NCAA-ready teams because the previous successful coach was lured away to another job.

I can post all the records of everyone from Coach K, to the best coaches in the MVC in the last 2 decades (Bruce Weber, Dana Altman, etc) if anyone is interested. None of their records for their first several years are very good, and few are any better than Jim Les'. Here are some of them.--
http://www.bradleyfans.com/phpbb/viewtopic.php?t=2194

The bashing of Jim Les that went on non-stop from 2002 to 2006 always liked to dwell on his record, and stress that Jim Les took over a team that some said was "loaded with talent", which it was not.
Jim was even blamed for the departures of guys like Joah Tucker, and Antoine Tisby, even though those 2 said publically that they decided to leave before Jim Molinari was fired. And, of course, he was blamed for the Granger transfer, even though another coaching staff cheated to steal him away.

I am sure you will remember that there were very few of us who stood by Jim Les and supported giving him more time to accomplish what he was doing and get his own players in place. The starting of BradleyFans.com was brought about because a few solid BU fans were tired of all the incessant Jim Les-bashing that went on in other public forums. I don't feel that I have to defend Jim Les' record any more, as he has clearly quieted nearly all those critics. But I do not accept that those teams he had his first couple years were any better than what we saw. The 2001-2002 team (with the players that you claim were so good) lost 20 games under Jim Molinari.

Jim Les has never lost 20 games.
And he has won 22 games each of the last 2 years (his 4th and 5th seasons), now that he has teams entirely of his own players. What other coaches in Bradley's history, or in the MVC have ever done that after taking over for a fired coach and a 20 loss season?
 
Da Coach said:
The starting of BradleyFans.com was brought about because a few solid BU fans were tired of all the incessant Jim Les-bashing that went on in other public forums.
Click to expand...

THANK GOD!

THANKYOU!

THANKYOU!

THANKYOU!
 
Da Coach said:
Well for one thing it was JL's first year...huge learning experience. We had some good players the next year and didn't have great records.
Click to expand...

We have seen this debated before. And this may be the last time I try to defend Jim Les, since his record now speaks for itself.
There have been extremely few successful coaches who have had winning teams in their first few years, unless they are fortunate to take over NCAA-ready teams because the previous successful coach was lured away to another job.

I can post all the records of everyone from Coach K, to the best coaches in the MVC in the last 2 decades (Bruce Weber, Dana Altman, etc) if anyone is interested. None of their records for their first several years are very good, and few are any better than Jim Les'. Here are some of them.--
http://www.bradleyfans.com/phpbb/viewtopic.php?t=2194

The bashing of Jim Les that went on non-stop from 2002 to 2006 always liked to dwell on his record, and stress that Jim Les took over a team that some said was "loaded with talent", which it was not.
Jim was even blamed for the departures of guys like Joah Tucker, and Antoine Tisby, even though those 2 said publically that they decided to leave before Jim Molinari was fired. And, of course, he was blamed for the Granger transfer, even though another coaching staff cheated to steal him away.

I am sure you will remember that there were very few of us who stood by Jim Les and supported giving him more time to accomplish what he was doing and get his own players in place. The starting of BradleyFans.com was brought about because a few solid BU fans were tired of all the incessant Jim Les-bashing that went on in other public forums. I don't feel that I have to defend Jim Les' record any more, as he has clearly quieted nearly all those critics. But I do not accept that those teams he had his first couple years were any better than what we saw. The 2001-2002 team (with the players that you claim were so good) lost 20 games under Jim Molinari.

Jim Les has never lost 20 games.
And he has won 22 games each of the last 2 years (his 4th and 5th seasons), now that he has teams entirely of his own players. What other coaches in Bradley's history, or in the MVC have ever done that after taking over for a fired coach and a 20 loss season?
Click to expand...

so the first year wasn't a learning experience for JL?...Do you think JL made all the right moves?..I'm guessing JL will tell you he's learned alot since starting.
What gets me is why some of you still feel you have defend JL any time someone mentions his name?
I didn't say anything bad about JL..it WAS his first year....he was inexperienced..he IS a quick learner and is doing a good job.
We are all glad he's here....
 
for those of you who want an update on Danny Granger, the Bull just beat the Pacers, Granger played nearly the entire game and was almost invisible.
He shot 20% from the field, missed all his 3-pt attempts, had only 7 points, and the Bulls came out on top 92-90.

This loss bumps the Pacers down the the #9 spot in the East, and is presently out of the playoffs unless they can win enough to overtake Orlando or New Jersey.
The Bulls have the 3rd best record in the East
 
tornado said:
for those of you who want an update on Danny Granger, the Bull just beat the Pacers, Granger played nearly the entire game and was almost invisible.
He shot 20% from the field, missed all his 3-pt attempts, had only 7 points, and the Bulls came out on top 92-90.

This loss bumps the Pacers down the the #9 spot in the East, and is presently out of the playoffs unless they can win enough to overtake Orlando or New Jersey.
The Bulls have the 3rd best record in the East
Click to expand...

I watch the box score for DG all the time..i think he had 22 the game before shooting like 9-15 or something like that.
Last I looked he was averaging over 13 a game...I don't think that's too bad
 
lefty said:
Da Coach said:
Lefty, I agree that most Bradley fans saw the potential that Danny Granger had. But my point was that in his 1 1/2 seasons at Bradley, what he showed on the court was not enough for other Division I coaches to be lining up to get him to transfer. I will stand by what I said, that if not for all the illegal calls by McKay and Broussard, Granger would have made his peace with Jim Les and stayed at Bradley for 4 years. Instead, when the differences occurred between Les and Granger, it became irreversible because Granger had Broussard talking in his ear on a daily basis encouraging him to split and go to New Mexico.
Click to expand...

well i agree about the lining up..but and it's only conjecture now....BU wasn't the only school to see DG's talent...I'm sure other's would have welcomed him to their team.
I also agee it may have been different if no contact between DB and Granger...I also think it may have been different if JL had been more experienced. I think he may have handled things differently too.
Click to expand...

That was always my biggest and really ONLY gripe..that DB wouldn't leave DG alone and let JL and BU handle it. Its like me trying to reconcile with my wife while some outside source is stabbing me behind my back.

DB new DG was ripe for the picking and did it under the guise of just being a mentor. If that WAS the case be open and honest and call BU/JL/KK and tell them that was what you were intending.

Tell them you WON'T accept DG as a transfer because alls you want to do is help him....but we know that wasn't the case. He wanted DG at UNM.
 
tornado said:
for those of you who want an update on Danny Granger, the Bull just beat the Pacers, Granger played nearly the entire game and was almost invisible.
He shot 20% from the field, missed all his 3-pt attempts, had only 7 points
Click to expand...

I bet Rick Carlisle isn't letting him eat or drink....
 
lefty said:
tornado said:
for those of you who want an update on Danny Granger, the Bull just beat the Pacers, Granger played nearly the entire game and was almost invisible.
He shot 20% from the field, missed all his 3-pt attempts, had only 7 points, and the Bulls came out on top 92-90.

This loss bumps the Pacers down the the #9 spot in the East, and is presently out of the playoffs unless they can win enough to overtake Orlando or New Jersey.
The Bulls have the 3rd best record in the East
Click to expand...

I watch the box score for DG all the time..i think he had 22 the game before shooting like 9-15 or something like that.
Last I looked he was averaging over 13 a game...I don't think that's too bad
Click to expand...

Nohe's not doing bad...

Here are his career stats:

2005-06: 78 games, 23.0mpg, 7.5ppg, 4.9rpg, 1.2apg, 0.7spg, FG%=42.2%, 3-pt%=32.3%
2006-07: 67 games, 33.3mpg, 13.4ppg, 4.7rpg, 1.2apg, 0.9spg, FG%=45.2%, 3-pt%=38.5%
 
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