Rebounding Issue

[BradleyBrave]

On the radio show this AM, Dan asked JL about playing one of our other 3 bigs as backup at the 4. JL said that he is very unhappy with the current (lack of) production from WE, SS and AT, so there is essentially no reason to reward that with more total minutes at the 4

Gotta call JL for 'BS' right here. It's hard to produce when you're sitting on the bench. AT got 3 minutes yesterday. It's hard to produce on either end when that's all you get. Will got 18, SS got 19, and AT got 3. That adds up to 40 which means not once, despite getting blasted on the boards, did we try 2 of them in at the same time. I see both WE and SS as our 2nd leading rebounders, despite playing less minutes than 6 other players. So, where's the accountability for those other guys when it comes to boxing out and rebounding? Andrew Warren is the only player that outrebounded WE and SS, which tells me that the others on the floor weren't doing their jobs. Yet our bigs are the ones being held accountable. Yeah, that makes sense.

[Beninator]

Gotta call JL for 'BS' right here. It's hard to produce when you're sitting on the bench. AT got 3 minutes yesterday. It's hard to produce on either end when that's all you get. Will got 18, SS got 19, and AT got 3. That adds up to 40 which means not once, despite getting blasted on the boards, did we try 2 of them in at the same time. I see both WE and SS as our 2nd leading rebounders, despite playing less minutes than 6 other players. So, where's the accountability for those other guys when it comes to boxing out and rebounding? Andrew Warren is the only player that outrebounded WE and SS, which tells me that the others on the floor weren't doing their jobs. Yet our bigs are the ones being held accountable. Yeah, that makes sense.

Bradleybrave, I think that we are in complete agreement that we need to try 2 bigs in the lineup at the same time. See my post on the starting lineup on another thread. My feeling is that we should try putting WE and AT in the lineup at the same time. We have one more game (Wofford) in which we can try experimenting with this!

[AZ BU Fan]

I am with maj 100%, and not having Taylor Brown is no excuse. There's not one reason that SS and WE couldn't play at the same time. Not one. It doesn't take a basketball savant to understand that when you play 4 guys 6'4" and under in Division I basketball, you're going to lose on the boards. I've seen high school teams put more size on the floor than we had yesterday. It nearly cost us a game.

Agree 100%

[AZ BU Fan]

Gotta call JL for 'BS' right here. It's hard to produce when you're sitting on the bench. AT got 3 minutes yesterday. It's hard to produce on either end when that's all you get. Will got 18, SS got 19, and AT got 3. That adds up to 40 which means not once, despite getting blasted on the boards, did we try 2 of them in at the same time. I see both WE and SS as our 2nd leading rebounders, despite playing less minutes than 6 other players. So, where's the accountability for those other guys when it comes to boxing out and rebounding? Andrew Warren is the only player that outrebounded WE and SS, which tells me that the others on the floor weren't doing their jobs. Yet our bigs are the ones being held accountable. Yeah, that makes sense.

Agree 100% here too BB.

All I can think of is there must be some 'fuzzy' logic that goes something like this: shoot and make enough 3's and FT's and you can beat other teams who make the same number, or more, of 2 pt baskets even with lots of put backs increasing opponents shooting pct.

[BU RICK]

What we are lacking on the bench is a bigs coach and someone to get in JL's ear during the games and help him out, like we did have during the S16 season. Do you think we could get Taylor's Dad to come up for a few months. And how about Joe Stowell to help show the guards how to pass the ball into the post.

[SFP]

I'm here right now to say CR or AW should never be playing the 4! They are undersized to ever be considered playing the 4 or even guarding the 4 player on just about any D-I team. There is a great chance of them getting injured playing and bouncing off bigger guys as well as it takes a lot more out of them on D which will take away from them on O. I'd like to see WE play a few minutes at the 4 occasionally, while SS or AT takes control of the 5 if MK is not ready to contribute.

[SaintLouBrave22]

Gosh, that almost makes you think that Looney Les (yes, I did say that) will eventually go with a 5 guard lineup or 4 guards and Taylor in the middle...


Very sad that he's so incredibly disinterested w/ players taller than 6'4" that he plans on being outrebounded and massacred in the paint night in and night out.


Some teams can get lucky and win with a 3 guard lineup, but no one plays or wins with 4 guards...and yes, you can look that up and try to prove me wrong, but I'm certain you'll find nothing.


We will NEVER win a Valley title playing this small...after this many years coaching, you'd figure he'd know this by now, but then again as I stated earlier, he still doesn't understand substitution patterns and player rotations and simply put, HE and not the opposing team breaks our momentum most of the time...

Why when you have ~10 pt lead would you sub in 3 guys, 2 of which who can't score?!


I'll just finish with this...


IF we continue with this 4 guard nonsense....

IF he continues to deflate our runs by sitting down a player (Warren) or group of players on streaks...

IF he believes that this continuosly terrible defense which has given up more wide open 3's and layups in the last 2-3 years than they EVER did with Coach CBuescher when he coached the D...


Then 6th place is about right.

[BradleyBrave]

Gosh, that almost makes you think that Looney Les (yes, I did say that) will eventually go with a 5 guard lineup or 4 guards and Taylor in the middle...


Very sad that he's so incredibly disinterested w/ players taller than 6'4" that he plans on being outrebounded and massacred in the paint night in and night out.


Some teams can get lucky and win with a 3 guard lineup, but no one plays or wins with 4 guards...and yes, you can look that up and try to prove me wrong, but I'm certain you'll find nothing.


We will NEVER win a Valley title playing this small...after this many years coaching, you'd figure he'd know this by now, but then again as I stated earlier, he still doesn't understand substitution patterns and player rotations and simply put, HE and not the opposing team breaks our momentum most of the time...

Why when you have ~10 pt lead would you sub in 3 guys, 2 of which who can't score?!


I'll just finish with this...


IF we continue with this 4 guard nonsense....

IF he continues to deflate our runs by sitting down a player (Warren) or group of players on streaks...

IF he believes that this continuosly terrible defense which has given up more wide open 3's and layups in the last 2-3 years than they EVER did with Coach CBuescher when he coached the D...


Then 6th place is about right.

Yup.

FWIW, the only player I saw cut off the baseline last night (a fundamental defensive principle taught in junior high) was DSE. I predict by year's end he isn't doing that anymore.

[BU_EMT128]

I definately agree with this SFP. Just like the offense revolved around Hawk, A. Parker, and other former Braves studs it needs to start with AW. BU NEEDS to find a way to make AW a star. I think a mid-major team almost always needs to have one star player to have a successful season. We need to get back to the days of having a team leader who averages 20+ ppg.

AW is a player who can take over a game and put a team on his back for a few minutes. He will be a HUGE key to our success this year.

[Braves4Life]

We will NEVER win a Valley title playing this small...after this many years coaching, you'd figure he'd know this by now.

Let me ask you this SLB. Do YOU have confidence in our bigs? Are they THAT impressive where you'd like to see 2 or 3 on the floor at the same time?

IMO, I think if you had any combination of AT, WE, SS, or MK on the floor at the same time (for an extended period) it would be a disaster. With the lack of footwork and foot speed you would have guys tripping all over themselves. Guys would be on the floor and it would look like a goal-line stand in football. I'm just not ready for the "matador" defense right now. And I prefer not to watch houses being built with all the bricks that would be thrown up.

JL knows his best chance to win is to play 4 athletic guys at the same time with one of the bigs. He'll go with 2 "smalls", 2 "mediums", and one "big". Or, we'll occasionally see 3 "smalls", 1 "medium", and 1 "big". Hopefully, our bigs can develop and earn JL's (and the other players) confidence during practice and earn their minutes.

Now, if this is a reflection of poor recruiting then so be it. But JL is just playing with the hand he's been dealt (and he's the dealer). As Herm Edwards so famously said: "You play to win the game!"

[SaintLouBrave22]

Let me ask you this SLB. Do YOU have confidence in our bigs? Are they THAT impressive where you'd like to see 2 or 3 on the floor at the same time?

IMO, I think if you had any combination of AT, WE, SS, or MK on the floor at the same time (for an extended period) it would be a disaster. With the lack of footwork and foot speed you would have guys tripping all over themselves. Guys would be on the floor and it would look like a goal-line stand in football. I'm just not ready for the "matador" defense right now. And I prefer not to watch houses being built with all the bricks that would be thrown up.

JL knows his best chance to win is to play 4 athletic guys at the same time with one of the bigs. He'll go with 2 "smalls", 2 "mediums", and one "big". Or, we'll occasionally see 3 "smalls", 1 "medium", and 1 "big". Hopefully, our bigs can develop and earn JL's (and the other players) confidence during practice and earn their minutes.

Now, if this is a reflection of poor recruiting then so be it. But JL is just playing with the hand he's been dealt (and he's the dealer). As Herm Edwards so famously said: "You play to win the game!"

I would be more confident playing Will at the 4 if Sam Singh is on the floor...

Thompson maybe but I don't have much confidence in him...

Will and Taylor will work well BUT only if we aren't playing Sammy and Eddren as well...


And in reality, if you've seen the two games with your own eyes, you'd know that we're a "+" in scoring numbers with Will on the floor, thus he should be getting closer to 30 mpg and not 10!


I'm just saying it for what it is...this team will never win with 4 guards as they will get hammered on the glass inside...


Just imagine playing 4 guards against UNI and Koch and Egleseder....you're asking Chris or Andrew to guard Koch....

I'm sorry, but thats a JOKE!


When you play Creighton, you're asking one of them to guard Carter...

Once again, a complete JOKE!



Les may think its so great to play with all of these guards, but when he was on the floor, would he have enjoyed guarding someone 4-6 inches taller than him or more physical or would he have enjoyed playing out of position?


Its just too much and it needs to be stopped...unless he plans on adding to the IL unemployment rate in a year or two...

[Beninator]

Let me ask you this SLB. Do YOU have confidence in our bigs? Are they THAT impressive where you'd like to see 2 or 3 on the floor at the same time?

IMO, I think if you had any combination of AT, WE, SS, or MK on the floor at the same time (for an extended period) it would be a disaster. With the lack of footwork and foot speed you would have guys tripping all over themselves. Guys would be on the floor and it would look like a goal-line stand in football. I'm just not ready for the "matador" defense right now. And I prefer not to watch houses being built with all the bricks that would be thrown up.

JL knows his best chance to win is to play 4 athletic guys at the same time with one of the bigs. He'll go with 2 "smalls", 2 "mediums", and one "big". Or, we'll occasionally see 3 "smalls", 1 "medium", and 1 "big". Hopefully, our bigs can develop and earn JL's (and the other players) confidence during practice and earn their minutes.

Now, if this is a reflection of poor recruiting then so be it. But JL is just playing with the hand he's been dealt (and he's the dealer). As Herm Edwards so famously said: "You play to win the game!"

I have stated and would like to see WE and AT on the floor at the same time. If we did that, I would want to see Sm, AW, and TB utilize the remaining positions. I think that this lineup gives us a legitimate shot at an inside-outside game.

[Braves4Life]

Will and Taylor will work well BUT only if we aren't playing Sammy and Eddren as well...


And in reality, if you've seen the two games with your own eyes, you'd know that we're a "+" in scoring numbers with Will on the floor, thus he should be getting closer to 30 mpg and not 10!


I'm just saying it for what it is...this team will never win with 4 guards as they will get hammered on the glass inside...

I have really liked what I have seen from WE. But he is our ONLY "big" who is a "player" right now. I'd like to see him get more minutes and develop more confidence. SS will NEED to be used judiciously against teams with "wide bodies", like UNI. It is up to Les to put the right combination on the floor when appropriate. I really think this team can win if it plays the following players the majority of minutes, and with limited times with SM and EM on the floor at the same time -- SM, EM, DSE, AW, TB, CR, WE,

[SaintLouBrave22]

I have stated and would like to see WE and AT on the floor at the same time. If we did that, I would want to see Sm, AW, and TB utilize the remaining positions. I think that this lineup gives us a legitimate shot at an inside-outside game.

Thats a pretty good lineup and would give the team multiple solid rebounders and shooters...

I do think though that Will, Taylor, Chris, Andrew, and Sammy/Dyricus is a good lineup and like I said before, I really like Andrew and Chris logging plenty of minutes as they're the most consistent players on the team...

Sam Singh and AT split the rest of the minutes at the 5 with Will taking most there and possibly a few at the 4.

Taylor gets the majority there with Milos getting a little time at the 4 and the 3.

[SaintLouBrave22]

I really think this team can win if it plays the following players the majority of minutes, and with limited times with SM and EM on the floor at the same time -- SM, EM, DSE, AW, TB, CR, WE,

I agree and this is our core...


I however don't think Sammy and Eddren should ever be on the floor at the same time...too many deficiencies in too many areas to address if you do that...

IF we play 2 PG's at the same time, one of the two should always be DSE.


Just as if Singh or Thompson are on the floor, Taylor should ALWAYS be on the floor as well because we'll need him for rebounding