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60 BU- 77 SIU Final

Facts:

-Taylor Brown has talent

-Both Dave Snell & Frank Bussone repeated the following phrases numerous times during their broadcasts last night...
"throws up a wild shot"
"another wild shot that had no chance to go in"
"off-balance leaner that barely hits the rim"
"need to get a good shot this time down the court"
"Braves have gone cold"

-Yet again - in a replay of just about every other opponent we have seen - SIU had literally dozens of wide open, unmolested layup and dunk opportunities...
Their low post players (Seck, Daniels, Drinkard) looked like Shaq...
they combined for 12-19, 34 points, and 21 rebounds.
Our low post players combined for 8 pts & 3 rebs.

-The game was lost in the first 10 minutes as the starters immediately dug a double digit hole for BU by playing and shooting poorly.
By even the time the first couple subs took place (15:04) we were down 11-2 and barely ever drew much closer..

-The two guys who shared PG duties (WL, DSE) were 5-18, 1-7 from 3-pt, 4 asst & 6 turnovers.
Seriously - how much worse could walk ons or the waterboy do??

-I know some may have other thoughts but here's just a fact...
Anthony Thompson played only 3 minutes...
His two short stints in the game came from ..
1st half 15:04 to 13:25...and
2nd half 13:52 to 12:50

BUT in those 2 minutes and 41 seconds - which is all AT played -
SIU scored only 4 pts on an outside jumper by Jeff Early and two FT's - and they got ABSOLUTELY no other baskets or rebounds ..
and not one of their low post players even got a decent look, a basket, nor a reboud - not even one rebound!

So - you decide - this is exactly what we saw when Doug McDermott killed Bradley for 44 points - and yet.............
.. in the 17 minutes AT played in that game, McDermott scored only 6 pts,
and in the other 23 minutes AT did not play - McDermott got his other 38 points.
When AT and Pross were in the game simultaneously (that occurred for 6 minutes) McDermott went scoreless!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Like him or not - Anthony Thompson's minutes in the game correlate directly with A TREMENDOUSLY REDUCED production
by the opponent and especially ZERO production by any of their post players!!!!!!


BTW -- as anyone who was there will attest -- the arena was EMPTY - they announced 3000 but that's a farse - more like 1500-1700...just check their photo gallery..
but..this is what happens after a couple years of playing poorly and not winning... ;)
 
tornado said:
Facts:

-Taylor Brown has talent

-Both Dave Snell & Frank Bussone repeated the following phrases numerous times during their broadcasts last night...
"throws up a wild shot"
"another wild shot that had no chance to go in"
"off-balance leaner that barely hits the rim"
"need to get a good shot this time down the court"
"Braves have gone cold"

-Yet again - in a replay of just about every other opponent we have seen - SIU had literally dozens of wide open, unmolested layup and dunk opportunities...
Their low post players (Seck, Daniels, Drinkard) looked like Shaq...
they combined for 12-19, 34 points, and 21 rebounds.
Our low post players combined for 8 pts & 3 rebs.

-The game was lost in the first 10 minutes as the starters immediately dug a double digit hole for BU by playing and shooting poorly.
By even the time the first couple subs took place (15:04) we were down 11-2 and barely ever drew much closer..

-The two guys who shared PG duties (WL, DSE) were 5-18, 1-7 from 3-pt, 4 asst & 6 turnovers.
Seriously - how much worse could walk ons or the waterboy do??

-I know some may have other thoughts but here's just a fact...
Anthony Thompson played only 3 minutes...
His two short stints in the game came from ..
1st half 15:04 to 13:25...and
2nd half 13:52 to 12:50

BUT in those 2 minutes and 41 seconds - which is all AT played -
SIU scored only 4 pts on an outside jumper by Jeff Early and two FT's - and they got ABSOLUTELY no other baskets or rebounds ..
and not one of their low post players even got a decent look, a basket, nor a reboud - not even one rebound!

So - you decide - this is exactly what we saw when Doug McDermott killed Bradley for 44 points - and yet.............
.. in the 17 minutes AT played in that game, McDermott scored only 6 pts,
and in the other 23 minutes AT did not play - McDermott got his other 38 points.
When AT and Pross were in the game simultaneously (that occurred for 6 minutes) McDermott went scoreless!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Like him or not - Anthony Thompson's minutes in the game correlate directly with A TREMENDOUSLY REDUCED production
by the opponent and especially ZERO production by any of their post players!!!!!!
Click to expand...

My guess here is that AT is a senior and he doesn't figure in Geno's future plans. Therefore, Geno is most likely playing the players who will be back next year and who will need to understand his system. That's just my theory, which btw I totally disagree with.

Just because AT won't be here next year doesn't mean he can't teach the returning guys how to play tough defense. And it's so ironic considering that AT is finally playing up to his potential after all these years! And his lack of playing is even more ironic considering how much Geno is leaning on TB, another player that won't be back next year. So I agree something doesn't make a lot of sense here!
 
PS - the Bocot foul on TB should have definitely been a flagrant - 2 shots and the ball out of bounds...
Not that it would have made any difference in the final result - but by NOT calling that foul properly - you essentially reward a player (Bocot)
for simply catching up to TB from behind and playing ZERO defense other than hooking his arm while TB's in mid-air, in a flagrant fashion to hope to deny the score,
while seriously endangering the shooter's safety......Geno saw it properly and argued but the refs rewarded SIU......
 
Bravesfan said:
My guess here is that AT is a senior and he doesn't figure in Geno's future plans. Therefore, Geno is most likely playing the players who will be back next year and who will need to understand his system. That's just my theory, which btw I totally disagree with.

Just because AT won't be here next year doesn't mean he can't teach the returning guys how to play tough defense. And it's so ironic considering that AT is finally playing up to his potential after all these years! And his lack of playing is even more ironic considering how much Geno is leaning on TB, another player that won't be back next year. So I agree something doesn't make a lot of sense here!
Click to expand...


+1
 
tornado said:
Like him or not - Anthony Thompson's minutes in the game correlate directly with A TREMENDOUSLY REDUCED production
by the opponent and especially ZERO production by any of their post players!!!!!!
Click to expand...


Just once this year, I would like to see AT start in in place of SS and with JP. I think it would help out JP as well! I guess it is asking a lot for a Bradley coach to go BIG!
 
that is wrong - -many coaches get the best players or take what they can get and mold the system to what they have..
that' what Calipari's doing and it's what Brad Stevens is doing...

every high school coach or AAU coach is the same - you have to utilize what you have...

BTW -- I saw where a lot of SIU fans were actually hoping for a loss -- they do not want anything even remotely to look good for fear
that their admin will keep Lowery...amazing....they want their team to lose - I have seen this sentiment before and it is ignorant wherever it crops up..
 
tornado said:
that is wrong - -many coaches get the best players or take what they can get and mold the system to what they have..
that' what Calipari's doing and it's what Brad Stevens is doing...

every high school coach or AAU coach is the same - you have to utilize what you have...

BTW -- I saw where a lot of SIU fans were actually hoping for a loss -- they do not want anything even remotely to look good for fear
that their admin will keep Lowery...amazing....they want their team to lose - I have seen this sentiment before and it is ignorant wherever it crops up..
Click to expand...

Specific to high school coaching, I completely agree since in most cases you don't get to pick your talent. However, in the college game, it's obviously much more conducive to selecting players who fit a preferred mold and/or style.
 
Obviously in an ideal world like maybe Mike Krzyzewski's you can have all the players you specifically target and want...
all other coaches - even college coaches - get and land the best that the factors allow them to land - and it'll likely NOT be all the ones they had as their top targets...
So - you still have to coach them into your system while at the same time utilizing their individual talents that were there before you recruited them..

A perfect example is Charron Woods...Geno recognizes that Geno brings something that is far and above more than was ever expected of him - thus since Geno can use it - he finds a way to work it (along with any shortcomings CW may have) into his game plan...
 
tornado said:
PS - the Bocot foul on TB should have definitely been a flagrant - 2 shots and the ball out of bounds...
Not that it would have made any difference in the final result - but by NOT calling that foul properly - you essentially reward a player (Bocot)
for simply catching up to TB from behind and playing ZERO defense other than hooking his arm while TB's in mid-air, in a flagrant fashion to hope to deny the score,
while seriously endangering the shooter's safety......Geno saw it properly and argued but the refs rewarded SIU......
Click to expand...

nope the refs called it right, Bocot made a play on the ball, caught brown on the forearms, brown grabbing the rim and falling down like he did made it seem a harder foul then it was.
 
tornado said:
Facts:



-I know some may have other thoughts but here's just a fact...
Anthony Thompson played only 3 minutes...
His two short stints in the game came from ..
1st half 15:04 to 13:25...and
2nd half 13:52 to 12:50

BUT in those 2 minutes and 41 seconds - which is all AT played -
SIU scored only 4 pts on an outside jumper by Jeff Early and two FT's - and they got ABSOLUTELY no other baskets or rebounds ..
and not one of their low post players even got a decent look, a basket, nor a reboud - not even one rebound!



BTW -- as anyone who was there will attest -- the arena was EMPTY - they announced 3000 but that's a farse - more like 1500-1700...just check their photo gallery..
but..this is what happens after a couple years of playing poorly and not winning... ;)
Click to expand...


um those 2 free throws were a result of AT fouling dantiel daniels, AT also had a turnover, and siu only had 4 posessions while AT was in the game and score on half of them.

And stop trying to guess attendance from pictures. SIU's attendance is down but not to 1500, in fact they've had more students recently to help increase the numbers.
 
Beninator said:
+1
Click to expand...

And just to clarify, I'm not bailing out on Geno yet, at least not until year 3 if they show no signs of gettng better. But I think it is a little strange that his lineups aren't totally matching who will probably be back next year.

I've read all the posts regarding why Geno plays who he plays. They range from the stock "best player in practice" to "playing only the players who will be back next year", to "the one's that understand the system", etc, etc, etc..... Fine, I do agree with most of these reasons, but the problem is this. He is obviously leaning heavily on TB since he is far and away the best and most experienced player on the team. So obviously he is hoping he can lead the team to some wins while the other returning players gain experience from him. And I understand some first year coaches "unintentionally" make sacrifice a few wins in order to establish the new system. If that's the case though, why is he playing TB but not AT? And not based on AT's slow development the last couple of years, but knowing very well that he has shined for the most part in the limited playing time he has seen this year, especially rebounding and on the defensive end? I believe Geno can still heavily play the players who will be coming back next, and the one's who are most deserving, while at the same time giving the team the best chance of winning. And I don't think sitting AT helps! AT may not be a great shooter, but as has been alluded to last night, the times he has been on the floor last night and during the Creighton game resulted in their best players behind held scoreless, especially when JP is on the floor at the same time.

So my guess is that Geno may be an offensive minded coach, but has made some mistakes when emphasising defense. If any game should have sent a message, it should have been the UNI game where great defensive stops led to great shooting opportunities on the opposite end of the court. So like I said, I'm certainly not throwing Geno under the bus, but I'm just saying that even in a rebuilding year a coaching staff needs to do everything they can to get some wins. And I don't know about anyone else, but 1 win in 10 conference games is not good enough. Even 3 wins makes a big difference in confidence and morale. That's why wins are important even in a rebuilding year.
 
Old Coach said:
Specific to high school coaching, I completely agree since in most cases you don't get to pick your talent. However, in the college game, it's obviously much more conducive to selecting players who fit a preferred mold and/or style.
Click to expand...

I agree, but in those certain years where a coach can't get all players that fit their style, the best coaches are able to tailor their system to fit what type of players they have.

But I also agree that certain coaches will go after more athletic players, where others will go after fundamentally sound players. That will always be the case for most coaches.
 
basketballshadow said:
..SIU's attendance is down but not to 1500..
Click to expand...

Da Coach and Big Mike were there and even several people on the Saluki message board pegged the attendance between 1500-2000..and the pictures don't lie and they aren't faked..


And so you're trying to get picky about the play-by-play but I note you actually don't dispute a single thing I said!

The facts stand that not one shot nor one basket was even recorded in the paint from any Saluki player during AT's stint on the court -- if he fouled a guy - so freaking what??
- maybe we need to lay a few hard fouls on guys going for the easy dunks in the lane...


Interestingly - from the point where AT fouled Daniels (12:50 remaining - virtually a FULL third of the game) - the very next time Daniels touches the ball in the paint he commits a turnover then gets yanked from the game...
He re-enters several times and YET from that point of the AT foul - at 12:50 remaining - Daniels DOES NOT make another basket from there all the way until the end of the game.
He gets a couple more FT's but not one single made basket!!!

SO - just maybe that foul by AT on Dantiel Daniels had exactly the effect that helped us the MOST!!!
Again, I rest my case...
 
i was there it wasn't 1500, oh and the people claiming that on salukitalk always think the athletic department isn't telling the truth.

as for AT i guess he should make room for his valley defensive player of the year cause he doesnt allow a basket in the paint in the 4 possessions SIU has when he is in by fouling his guy on the one attempt in the lane:D
 
basketballshadow said:
i was there it wasn't 1500, oh and the people claiming that on salukitalk always think the athletic department isn't telling the truth.

as for AT i guess he should make room for his valley defensive player of the year cause he doesnt allow a basket in the paint in the 4 possessions SIU has when he is in by fouling his guy on the one attempt in the lane:D
Click to expand...

All I was stating on my previous post was that it wouldn't hurt to try some different combinations once in a while. What does the team have to lose by giving AT and others a little extra playing time to see what we have? Nothing at this stage of the season. Otherwise, I think Geno is doing what he can trying to establish his system with what players we have. But he can still tweak a bit to fit with what players we have, while still keeping most of the system intact.
 
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