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Anything I say is of little significance

amckillip said:
I HAVE had posts deleted, but this is by far the best DISCUSSION board I've been on. Think about it like a debate, there are rules and regulation to make it more productive.
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Hit the nail on the head. I have had posts deleted too. But people don't need to take it personally if they are deleted.
 
Da Coach said:
Thanks for your usually cogent point of view, TAS-

Just a couple things more-
I said JL has done a good job, because though the detractors will acknowledge nothing more than a "lucky 6 week" period in 2006, Bradley has played the strongest schedule over the past 5 years of any MVC team. They have won 102 games in the last 5 years, they have never finished in the lower half of the conference, they have as many NCAA wins as all but maybe 1 other school, they have far more post-season wins than any MVC school, and I could go on with listing the positives, but I think any rational fan will admit that the last 5 years have not been the disaster than a few people try to portray. Nobody is totally satisfied, and I would like to see better finishes. But considering the serious injuries to key players, I can understand why some of the teams have underachieved. There are some who aren't willing to be reasonable about those intangibles.

The Letter- I have been informed by a reliable source that the person who wrote the letter is a former long-time Peoria Journal Star employee.
Maybe that doesn't mean anything to most readers, but, IMO if this is true, that should have been disclosed, and leads many readers to suspect a potential conflict of interest, and possible a lack of integrity.

And one more thing regarding the anti-JL crowd, and my use of the term "agenda". There are some who have specific agendas, and it is not always to see Bradley win.
Without going into greater detail, I have saved several long PMs and emails sent by a couple former posters on this site, who no longer post (not by their own choice), and forwarded to me. In these messages, these self anointed Jim Les-haters list incidents that they detail to try to convince others that Jim Les is a bad guy, and to support their admitted hatred of him.
They felt that if they decribed their issues with Jim Les enough, they would convince others what an awful man, and terrible coach he was.
But many of us know Coach Les, and he is nothing like what those couple haters described. So when I use the term "agenda", I mean it to describe a type of person, like these I am referring to, who have an irrational hatred for a decent man, and who admit they are dedicated to trying to bring him down in any way they can. I have the proof I need to show that there are irrational JL-haters out there, and there are still others around who masquerade as Bradley "fans", and they are not going to be allowed to poison this site.
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It's been an interesting couple of days on this post, and the conspiracy theories have run the gamut, so as the letter writer, let me clear up a few things for you. First of all, any of you with "sources"; they're worthless. These are the people that think Elvis is still alive. The facts:

I an NOT and never have been an employee of the Peoria Journal Star
I AM a season ticket holder
I AM a graduate of Bradley University
I am NOT a financial contributor to the University

I am just a regular joe that sits in the upper bowl with all of the regular joes, and trust me, nobody up there or on the street, or in the bars, is bragging about what a good job JL has done with the team, and that's why the letter was written. There is no personal attack on the man or the team in this letter and to read that into it is ridiculous. I even made a point to admit what a great player he was, and I think he is a great speaker during the game day luncheons, but as a coach, it's just not happening. As one of the posters said, I don't want Bradley to fail, far from it. I've been going to BU games since 1973 and I'm starving for a winner, but I'm not a fan because I criticize a coach? Give me a break. Look, people go to work every day, Cat engineers, car salesmen, secretaries, and they try their best, but if they don't succeed, they get fired. What's the difference if it's a basketball coach? So if you want to know my "agenda" since I guess you have to have one when you criticize a coach, here it is: Aspire to be better. Look to the Gonzagas and the Butlers and see that a small school can win at a higher level. Are you really satisfied being in 4th place and a 70-74 record in 8 years? Sorry, but I'm not.
 
zeeman said:
It's been an interesting couple of days on this post, and the conspiracy theories have run the gamut, so as the letter writer, let me clear up a few things for you. First of all, any of you with "sources"; they're worthless. These are the people that think Elvis is still alive. The facts:

I an NOT and never have been an employee of the Peoria Journal Star
I AM a season ticket holder
I AM a graduate of Bradley University
I am NOT a financial contributor to the University

I am just a regular joe that sits in the upper bowl with all of the regular joes, and trust me, nobody up there or on the street, or in the bars, is bragging about what a good job JL has done with the team, and that's why the letter was written. There is no personal attack on the man or the team in this letter and to read that into it is ridiculous. I even made a point to admit what a great player he was, and I think he is a great speaker during the game day luncheons, but as a coach, it's just not happening. As one of the posters said, I don't want Bradley to fail, far from it. I've been going to BU games since 1973 and I'm starving for a winner, but I'm not a fan because I criticize a coach? Give me a break. Look, people go to work every day, Cat engineers, car salesmen, secretaries, and they try their best, but if they don't succeed, they get fired. What's the difference if it's a basketball coach? So if you want to know my "agenda" since I guess you have to have one when you criticize a coach, here it is: Aspire to be better. Look to the Gonzagas and the Butlers and see that a small school can win at a higher level. Are you really satisfied being in 4th place and a 70-74 record in 8 years? Sorry, but I'm not.
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AWESOME. Thank you and please post anytime. I for one really really enjoyed your post and your candidness.
 
Wow Zeeman. I did not think anything could stop the spin doctors. I can hear crickets chirping when I open this thread now.

I think you have a right to have and express your opinion. Thanks.

P.S. Love the Elvis reference.
 
New Guy said:
Wow Zeeman. I did not think anything could stop the spin doctors. I can hear crickets chirping when I open this thread now.

I think you have a right to have and express your opinion. Thanks.

P.S. Love the Elvis reference.
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Don't worry...the spin doctors will likely be back soon with 'proof' that zeeman is NOT the guy that wrote the letter in to the Journal Star...
He is just another imposter that is out here to try an undermine their credibility and make this site look bad...

Too funny.
 
zeeman said:
It's been an interesting couple of days on this post, and the conspiracy theories have run the gamut, so as the letter writer, let me clear up a few things for you. First of all, any of you with "sources"; they're worthless. These are the people that think Elvis is still alive. The facts:

I an NOT and never have been an employee of the Peoria Journal Star
I AM a season ticket holder
I AM a graduate of Bradley University
I am NOT a financial contributor to the University

I am just a regular joe that sits in the upper bowl with all of the regular joes, and trust me, nobody up there or on the street, or in the bars, is bragging about what a good job JL has done with the team, and that's why the letter was written. There is no personal attack on the man or the team in this letter and to read that into it is ridiculous. I even made a point to admit what a great player he was, and I think he is a great speaker during the game day luncheons, but as a coach, it's just not happening. As one of the posters said, I don't want Bradley to fail, far from it. I've been going to BU games since 1973 and I'm starving for a winner, but I'm not a fan because I criticize a coach? Give me a break. Look, people go to work every day, Cat engineers, car salesmen, secretaries, and they try their best, but if they don't succeed, they get fired. What's the difference if it's a basketball coach? So if you want to know my "agenda" since I guess you have to have one when you criticize a coach, here it is: Aspire to be better. Look to the Gonzagas and the Butlers and see that a small school can win at a higher level. Are you really satisfied being in 4th place and a 70-74 record in 8 years? Sorry, but I'm not.
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well said!
 
zeeman said:
It's been an interesting couple of days on this post, and the conspiracy theories have run the gamut, so as the letter writer, let me clear up a few things for you. First of all, any of you with "sources"; they're worthless. These are the people that think Elvis is still alive. The facts:

I an NOT and never have been an employee of the Peoria Journal Star
I AM a season ticket holder
I AM a graduate of Bradley University
I am NOT a financial contributor to the University

I am just a regular joe that sits in the upper bowl with all of the regular joes, and trust me, nobody up there or on the street, or in the bars, is bragging about what a good job JL has done with the team, and that's why the letter was written. There is no personal attack on the man or the team in this letter and to read that into it is ridiculous. I even made a point to admit what a great player he was, and I think he is a great speaker during the game day luncheons, but as a coach, it's just not happening. As one of the posters said, I don't want Bradley to fail, far from it. I've been going to BU games since 1973 and I'm starving for a winner, but I'm not a fan because I criticize a coach? Give me a break. Look, people go to work every day, Cat engineers, car salesmen, secretaries, and they try their best, but if they don't succeed, they get fired. What's the difference if it's a basketball coach? So if you want to know my "agenda" since I guess you have to have one when you criticize a coach, here it is: Aspire to be better. Look to the Gonzagas and the Butlers and see that a small school can win at a higher level. Are you really satisfied being in 4th place and a 70-74 record in 8 years? Sorry, but I'm not.
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Thanks....I am happy to say I knew it all along and was laughing at how blown out of proportion it was all getting and how the same very thing we are told to avoid (rumors, specualtion, attacks) were being levied against a simple fan with a simple opinion with absolutley NO agenda.......ANOTHER thing we are told that all those that aren't happy with JL must have.

Glad you came out Zeeman. I'd like to have been a fly on the computer screen at a few homes.
 
I decided since so many of you think BU should be competing for league titles and should start to compete for final four appearances I checked out how many "MID-MAJORS" have been in the final 4 since 1979 (I only included that because of Ind St)take a look for yourselves. In 31 years
including Depaul (I do not beleive they were considered a major in 1979) & Memphis it has happened only 6 times in 31 years-take them out & you end up w/ Ind St, Penn (both in 1979) and George Mason in 06 and now Butler in 2010.:idea:
So lets face reality guys the chances of BU going to a final 4 are very slim no matter who the coach is.
Is this a plug for JL? Not at all but we also do not know what happens in practice and, yes, we are all entitled to our opinions but it is a lot easier to coach from the stand then from the bench-especially when most of us either played the game 20-40 years ago or more and have never even coached a game. It doesn't mean one isn't entitled to their opinion but but it easier to complain then it is to actaully coach. I Know as I have been on both sides of the ball.


Michigan St, Indiana St, DePaul, Penn
Louisville, UCLA, Iowa, Purdue
Indiana, North Carolina, LSU, Virginia
North Car, G'town, Louisville, Houston
N.C. State, Houston, Louisville, Georgia
Georgetown, Houston, Kentucky, Virginia
Villanova, G'town, Memphis, St. John's
Louisville, Duke, Kansas, LSU
Indiana, Syracuse, UNLV, Providence
Kansas, Oklahoma, Duke, Arizona
Michigan, Seton Hall, Duke, Illinois
UNLV, Duke, Arkansas, Georgia Tech
Duke, Kansas, North Carolina, UNLV
Duke, Michigan, Indiana, Cincinnati
North Car, Michigan, Kansas, Kentucky
Arkansas, Duke, Arizona, Florida
UCLA, Arkansas, Okla State, North Car
Kentucky, Syracuse, Miss St, UMass
Arizona, Kentucky, Minnesota, North Car
Kentucky, Utah, North Carolina, Stanford
UConn, Duke, Ohio St, Michigan St
Michigan St, Florida, North Car, Wisconsin
Duke, Arizona, Michigan St, Maryland
Maryland, Indiana, Kansas, Oklahoma
Syracuse, Kansas, Texas, Marquette
UConn, Georgia Tech, Okla State, Duke
North Car, Illinois, Michigan St, Louisville
Florida, UCLA, LSU, George Mason
Florida, UCLA, Ohio St, G'town
Kansas, North Carolina, Memphis, UCLA

 
basketball nut said:
I decided since so many of you think BU should be competing for league titles and should start to compete for final four appearances

Id settle for competing for something other then the 4/5 MVC tourney game and bitting nails about avoiding a play in game.

But you are right many of us do expect to compete for league titles at a minimum. The middle of the pack stuff is real old.

Final fours... well that would be nice but I dont think there is but a very small minoriety of BU fans who will ever think this program should compete regularly for a final four, but lets be honest if Butler can pull it off any school in the Valley should emulate and goal to be equal to if not exceed with Butler does.

It does not hurt anyone to challenge yourself to be the best.
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basketball nut said:
I decided since so many of you think BU should be competing for league titles and should start to compete for final four appearances I checked out how many "MID-MAJORS" have been in the final 4 since 1979 (I only included that because of Ind St)take a look for yourselves. In 31 years
including Depaul (I do not beleive they were considered a major in 1979) & Memphis it has happened only 6 times in 31 years-take them out & you end up w/ Ind St, Penn (both in 1979) and George Mason in 06 and now Butler in 2010.:idea:
So lets face reality guys the chances of BU going to a final 4 are very slim no matter who the coach is.
Is this a plug for JL? Not at all but we also do not know what happens in practice and, yes, we are all entitled to our opinions but it is a lot easier to coach from the stand then from the bench-especially when most of us either played the game 20-40 years ago or more and have never even coached a game. It doesn't mean one isn't entitled to their opinion but but it easier to complain then it is to actaully coach. I Know as I have been on both sides of the ball.


Michigan St, Indiana St, DePaul, Penn
Louisville, UCLA, Iowa, Purdue
Indiana, North Carolina, LSU, Virginia
North Car, G'town, Louisville, Houston
N.C. State, Houston, Louisville, Georgia
Georgetown, Houston, Kentucky, Virginia
Villanova, G'town, Memphis, St. John's
Louisville, Duke, Kansas, LSU
Indiana, Syracuse, UNLV, Providence
Kansas, Oklahoma, Duke, Arizona
Michigan, Seton Hall, Duke, Illinois
UNLV, Duke, Arkansas, Georgia Tech
Duke, Kansas, North Carolina, UNLV
Duke, Michigan, Indiana, Cincinnati
North Car, Michigan, Kansas, Kentucky
Arkansas, Duke, Arizona, Florida
UCLA, Arkansas, Okla State, North Car
Kentucky, Syracuse, Miss St, UMass
Arizona, Kentucky, Minnesota, North Car
Kentucky, Utah, North Carolina, Stanford
UConn, Duke, Ohio St, Michigan St
Michigan St, Florida, North Car, Wisconsin
Duke, Arizona, Michigan St, Maryland
Maryland, Indiana, Kansas, Oklahoma
Syracuse, Kansas, Texas, Marquette
UConn, Georgia Tech, Okla State, Duke
North Car, Illinois, Michigan St, Louisville
Florida, UCLA, LSU, George Mason
Florida, UCLA, Ohio St, G'town
Kansas, North Carolina, Memphis, UCLA

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basketball nut, I applaud you for your reasoned and thoughtful post and appreciate the time and effort you spent in putting together that list.

I do think there are some consistency issues in your post.

First, I've been around the message boards for 13 years and I've never seen or read anyone's thoughts that BU should be competing for Final Fours.

That said, you start by saying in 1979 that DePaul, InSU, and Penn were mid-major counters.

Fine. But then you omit schools like UNLV (Big West at the time), Utah (WAC at the time) and UMass from a watered-down A10.

Now granted, the Big West and A10 at those times were stronger basketball leagues than say the MVC at the time, they still were by no means "major". In fact it was considered a big move when UNLV went to the 16-team WAC, and a big step for the best of the best from the WAC to form the MWC.

Given the breakdown and league membership changes in the 1980's and early 1990's, the basketball landscape was a bit more wide-open and allowed for schools from leagues like the Great Midwest (Memphis) and the above to put together powerhouse programs and reach the Final Four from significantly lesser leagues.
 
I think Zeeman's last paragraph sums up exactly what I and the majority of BU fans think. Excellent post. I wish some in the minority would realize the truthfulness in that paragraph instead of sticking their heads in the sand and pretending things are great.
 
If that was anywhere near the majority opinion Bradley would not be drawing 9000+ every game or drawing 1500+ to drive down to St. Louis, or seeing unprecendented revenue streams despite what our leaders tell us is the worst economic times since the Great Depression.

It's my experience that his opinion represents a minority of disgruntled fans, and they are welcome to their opinions. After 4 consecutive 20+ win seasons, one 16-15 season causes the sky-is-falling crowd to go into panic and try to seize the opportunity to get a coaching change, just like 2002. Most solid fans just don't see it that way.

Why do the negative nellies worry so much what others think? Why is it so important to them to try to shout down anyone who doesn't agree with them?
 
Da Coach said:
Why do the negative nellies worry so much what others think? Why is it so important to them to try to shout down anyone who doesn't agree with them?
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Wasn't this what was done with the letter to the editor? A person doesn't agree with many BU fans that everything is ok, he gets a letter printed and his actual existence is questioned. A lot of time was spent on this board to try and prove why this guy wasn't real and even if he was that his opinion was so wrong.

Personally, I like hearing both sides of the argument. There are people who will love JL no matter what happens, there are people who are going to hate JL no matter what happens. For some people the Sweet 16 and 3 20 win seasons in a row are awesome. Some see the 20 win seasons as a mirage because we had to play in lesser tourneys to reach that total. I think the majority of people are somewhere in the middle.
 
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