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Big East Catholic Schools Getting Restless

there is a chance that the fallout could get even a notch worse...
Bradley could conceivably be a consideration for a mega-conference that is basketball driven such as SLU, Creighton, etc....if there's not enough Catholic schools to fill their needs...
...or possibly as an option for a league of those left over but not Catholic like Butler...
problem is - right now we're sitting on the immediate history of a 17-league-loss season that might be the deal-killer. ...
time will tell...............
 
I just hope the powers in place don't sit back and do nothing. I have said for 3 years that they need to be communicating w/ these other basketball only schools (especially keeping CU close) because this was going to happen-just never thought it would be that many from the same conference.
I have said for a long time that there are 10 very good BB only schools in the midwest that would make a great conference.
Let's not be left out.
 
Unless Bradley would've binked a final four recently, it wouldn't matter how good or bad we were going into this round of realignment. The results of one or two years aren't simply that important, unless they involve the Final Four in some capacity.

The last 2 seasons are completely irrelevant compared to the market problem that Bradley has in relation to current realignment.
 
TheAsianSensation said:
Unless Bradley would've binked a final four recently, it wouldn't matter how good or bad we were going into this round of realignment. The results of one or two years aren't simply that important, unless they involve the Final Four in some capacity.

The last 2 seasons are completely irrelevant compared to the market problem that Bradley has in relation to current realignment.
Click to expand...

Agree and there lies the real problem but there are certain positive variables that BU brings to the table. As I said in another post BU needs to be aggressive and try to set what an ideal conference looks like. They need to try and sit at the table to influence the standards that will shape the brand. If you ask me The Big Ten has done this almost to perfection. The Ivy League has also built a strong brand around education and lead every other conference when it comes to endowment, which at the end of the day is what each school cares about most. Everything I've heard from Prez. Glasser tells me that she is no different. Now can she execute on a plan that continues the achievements that have been made the last decade? Basketball success is a big part of it and again she has said as much.
 
Rusty 54 said:
How quickly could BU become a Catholic school...
Click to expand...

I'm not to worried about not being a Catholic school. I'm sure a pure Catholic conference would not be in the best interest of their brand. I betting that to appease the faculty they will be hedging on some sort of academic standard.
 
Da Coach said:
OK, you and many others have said this, but what exactly do you propose?
The only consistently "better" conferences than the MVC are-
ACC
Big East
SEC
Big Ten
Big 12
Pac 12
Atlantic 10

That's it. Bradley would not stand a chance of being considered by the Catholic colleges to be included in their new conference. And there is zero chance the first 6 (all major football conferences) would have any remote interest in Bradley or the Peoria market.
So that only leaves the A-10, which would have to loose a bunch of teams before they would possibly be interested in Bradley, and I am not sure that would happen under any circumstances, or the CUSA, which IMO is not as good a conference as the MVC (even without Creighton), and there are many other schools they would be likely to pursue ahead of Bradley (namely football schools).
Out of the next batch of conferences, only the Horizon League would make any sense at all for Bradley since it is basketball-only, but that is a huge step down.
So other than getting in on some completely newly created conference, which nobody is even talking about, I simply do not see anything even close to as good for BU than to stay aligned with the MVC schools. The MVC has survived well over 100 years despite the departure of a lot of other good schools along the way. They have always recovered from losing their top schools by adding others in the past, and would remain viable and successful by doing it again, IMO..
Click to expand...

Agreed on all counts. However, if there even exists a sliver of hope for improving our status by moving into one of these better conferences, Glasser, Cross and Elgin at least need to make some serious attempts. That said, if as is expected we are not granted entrance into a new Catholic basketball league or a revamped A-10, I still think there will be some decent teams floating out there that will be looking for new homes. Butler may very well be the one great team left out due to geographical issues and having to settle for a potentially watered down A-10. In that case, it would make more sense for them to either join the Valley or the Horizon. Maybe a little power grab between those two conferences once the dust settles on everything else!
 
tornado said:
there is a chance that the fallout could get even a notch worse...
Bradley could conceivably be a consideration for a mega-conference that is basketball driven such as SLU, Creighton, etc....if there's not enough Catholic schools to fill their needs...
...or possibly as an option for a league of those left over but not Catholic like Butler...
problem is - right now we're sitting on the immediate history of a 17-league-loss season that might be the deal-killer. ...
time will tell...............
Click to expand...

As I mentioned in my post above, Butler will be a very interesting wild card in all of this. How great will Butler feel being left in a watered down A-10 with a much higher travel budget than if they moved into the Valley or back into the Horizon? My guess is not very good!

I guess this is where a second-tier "A-10" would come into play. That is the current A-10 minus Dayton, Xavier, VCU and St. Louis, but with a lot of the scrubs left over that have been weighing down the conference in recent years. This is where the likes of Bradley and Butler would be fighting with the best of CUSA and basketball only programs from the Valley, MAC and Horizon to form a potential "super-conference" that may be lucky to get two or three bids into the NCAA Tournament. But it would be the best of the "leftovers" so to speak, and that might be the last best option for Bradley short of a revamped Valley with hopefully some decent teams purged from the other mid-major conferences.

I would say at this point to let the administration and Elgin do what they need to do to try to get into one of the better conferences. As for our fans though, I would not worry too much about any of this right now until the pieces officially start to fall into place regarding the "Catholic 7" from the Big East. Lots of manuevering and potential lawsuits to go before we even begin to see where the Valley will fall into this.
 
I doubt Bradley would ever be considered for any of these larger conferences as our athletic teams have not been competitive at all in just about every sport except soccer , not sure we could afford the travel expenses that would be quite expensive when you look at the overall geography of these schools, best thing for us is to to stay in the Valley and hope that the league can find more members to replace any that leave, I hate to point this out but no conference is going to recruit us for membership as what exactly do we offer that would appeal to them.
 
Creighton officials declined to comment Thursday on whether the school would have any interest in becoming part of a new conference that would include seven former members of the Big East.
Where, or if, Creighton figures into any scenario should the seven schools break away is uncertain. Athletic Director Bruce Rasmussen said any comment about the developing situation would have to come from the Rev. Timothy Lannon, the school??™s president.
Through a spokesperson, Lannon said that it was ???too premature for the university to make any comment at this point.???

http://www.omaha.com/article/20121213/BLUEJAYS/712139853

Sounds like there are no denials coming from Creighton. :roll:
 
of course they're gonna consider it...

but just like Saint Louis when they went to a conference full of teams from a thousand miles out east - then were quite unhappy...

Creighton might JUST be shooting themselves in the foot if they do this...but time will tell - it reminds me of how Louisville has always been looking to jump to a better league but is never happy more than a few years then jumps again...MVC-->Metro-->CUSA-->Big East-->ACC...but at least they've been successful....
Some of the other multi-jumping schools like Rutgers, S. Carolina, Southern Miss, Tulane, SLU, Houston, UAB, Rice, Utep, Tulsa, Duquesne, UMass, St. Bonaventure, URI, & VCU are all seemingly always dissatisfied...

But Creighton's decision will be tough...
First - because they are already massively successful, they fill their 17,000 seat arena, and have LOTS of NATURAL geographical rivalries right now that are profitable...
Were they the farthest WEST school in a conference or largely eastern schools - they might just feel out of place and have burdensome travel expenses in all sports..

second - Creighton has also been greatly successful in soccer and other sports - but contrary to what you'd think, Seton Hall, Providence, DePaul..all have weak soccer programs...the Jays could be better off in the MVC

Then - then there's the chance that when they get to a conference with Georgetown, Marquette, Xavier, etc...they might just find themselves perennially in the basement in a lot of sports - especially basketball...and also outcoached at that level - as you recall when McDermott was at a BCS school (Iowa State) - he couldn't even beat the midmajors, and routinely got hammered by Valleyteams....
Sure they are very good this year - but this is possibly an aberration due to one tremendously talented kid who will be gone shortly...not to mention that Greg McDermott still doesn't have much of an NCAA resume...
The guy has been coaching 20 years, yet has only gone to the NCAA 4 times - three of which were at UNI and they never won a single game - and then they won ONE game last year despite a 29 win season.



BTW -- I know it's a longshot - but Bradley's best bet might just be to convert to Catholicism -- ;)
 
Imaginary phone transcripts from Doug Elgin yesterday:

--2:00pm--
DePaul Athletics Receptionist: DePaul Athletics, how may I direct your call?
Doug Elgin: Hi, this is Doug Elgin, Commissioner of the Missouri Valley Conference, I'd like to speak to your AD about joining the Valley.
Receptionist: Let me check if he's available, please hold. (Sweet Home Chicago hold music)
-Receptionst intercom to AD: Hey, its MVC, they want us to join the Valley.
-DePaul AD to intercom: HAHAHAHA! Put him through.
DePaul AD: Hello Doug, what can I do for you today?
DE: I've been hearing that you guys are thinking about disolving the Big East. I think that DePaul would be a great addition to our conference because of the proximity to our schools and the expansion of the MVC into Chicagoland. We'll move all of our tournaments up there too. Think of the travel you guys can save having to fly all over the country trying to keep up with all those football schools. Since the Big East is likely dissolving, why don't you come to a stable conference that can build up your athletics program. You have to admit, its been a pretty rough time playing those Big East team, no?
DePaul AD: Yeah, it would be nice to get to play some weak teams occasionally. Saving on travel would be nice, but I can't remember where all of your schools are though, aren't they all south of I-80?
DE: No, Northern Iowa is significantly north of I-80 in Cedar Falls, Creighton is 2 miles north of I-80 in Omaha, and Drake is only 2 miles south of I-80 in Des Moines.
[Click]
DE: Regardless, you should be able to fly direct to almost every city in the Valley out of Chicago. So what do you think about joining? [Silence] Hello? Hello?

DE: Oh rats...Maybe Marquette won't be so pretentious since Milwaukee isn't as big as Chicago. I'll give them a call.

--2:02pm--
Marquette Athletics Receptionist: Good afternoon, Marquette Athletics, how may I direct your call?
Doug Elgin: Hi, this is Doug Elgin, Commissioner of the Missouri Valley Conference, I'd like to speak to your AD about joining the MVC.
MU Athletics Receptionist: Let me check if he's available, please hold. (Beer Barrel Polka hold music)
-MU Receptionst intercom to AD: Hey, its another conference trying to get us to join.
-MU AD: Is it the A-10? I've been waiting for their call. I'm sick of having to talk to these guys like Conference USA trying to get us to come back or the Horizon thinking that a UW Milwaukke rivalry would be a good fit.
-MU Receptionist: No, MVC.
-MU AD to intercom: Oh lord, I need a laugh, put him through.
MU AD: Hi Mr Elgin, can I call you Dirk? So Dirk, what makes you think that you and the lowly MVC schools are worthy of playing our caliber athletic teams? Our basketball program is consistently in the Sweet 16.
DE: Its Doug, sir. I think that Marquette would be a great addition to our conference because of the proximity to our schools and the expansion of the MVC into a major midwest market like Milwaukee. Since the Big East is likely dissolving, why don't you come to a stable conference who isn't looking to compete with the BCS football money grab.
MU AD: So you like Milwaukee? It is a great midwestern city, lots of history, strong sports following. I'm amazed we never considered joining the MVC previously.
DE: Yeah, me too. Milwaukee fits the profile very well for an MVC school.
MU AD: So why don't you call UW Milwaukee?
DE: Haha, good one, we're not worried about the Horizon schools, they're just low mid-majors now that Butler left. We want to add some quality programs to challenge Creighton, otherwise they might leave us.
MU AD: So you guys are scrambling to keep together the best you have or else you're going to become irrelevant?
DE: Yeah, I guess I was a little to candid with you there.
MU AD: Guess so. We'll let you know what happens. We might be in touch about Creighton's exit fee. Thanks for the call. [Hangs up]

DE: Man, I really thought that would have gone better. We've got a lot going for us in our little midwest footprint. Maybe I should see about expanding the footprint out east...hmm, who should I call?

--2:04pm--
Georgetown Athletics Receptionist: (Hmm, where is this area code from on the caller ID) Thank you for calling Georgetown Athletics, how may I help you today?
Doug Elgin: Hi, this is Doug Elgin, Commissioner of the Missouri Valley Conference, I'd like to speak to your AD about joining the MVC.
Receptionist: I'm sorry, you said, the Mississippi Valley?
DE: No, Missouri Valley, you know the 10 team midwestern conference that includes Creighton and Bradley. Creighton has been a national force in college basketball for a few years now and Bradley claims that Harvard is the Bradley of the midwest.
Receptionist: Oh, impressive. Well I'm sorry, our AD is on the phone right now. I'll let him know you called. [Click]
DE: Well, do you need my number? Hello? Oh darn, guess this just isn't my day.

-Receptionist to GU AD later on: So a Doug Elgin called about joining the Missouri Valley Conference. I guess its the conference with Creighton and Bradley? Didn't I just dial up Creighton for you earlier today?
-GU AD: Yes, we're really hoping Creighton hops ship and joins our new Big Catholic Conference.
-Receptionist: Geez, I feel bad for that guy. He was also talking about some school named Bradley. Weren't they good at basketball in the the 80's and the 50's?
-GU AD: Probably.
 
Da Coach said:
I don't entirely agree. I think the MVC can survive without Creighton, or any of the current members. It wouldn't be easy to replace them with a school equal to them now, but recall that Creighton was not always a basketball power. But there would be no shortage of schools that would like to get into the MVC.

Again, these programs are not where Creighton is right now, but they could benefit and thrive in the MVC.
Here are a lot of good midmajor private schools:
Horizon members- Detroit (which was a member of the MVC from 1949-50 and 1956-57), Valpo, and Loyola (how nice would it be to have a Chicago school in the MVC, and they would jump at the chance)
Ohio Valley- Belmont (they are the only private school in the OVC)
Southland- Oral Roberts (the MVC makes a lot more sense for them- they are the only private school in the Southland)
WAC- Denver, which is a private school, would give the MVC another large market, though it is geographically remote from the rest of the MVC.
Atlantic 10- If St. Louis is not included with the ex-Big East Catholic schools, they would be perfect for the MVC. They were members of the MVC in the past (1937-1943, 1944-1974), and some people there feel it was a mistake to get into the A-10.
And if the A-10 falls apart, there are a bunch of other good private schools to look at.

And also a lot of good public schools to consider-
MAC- Akron, Toledo, Ohio, NIU, and others (all 12 members of the MAC are public schools)
Other Horizon members- Cleveland St., Illinois Chicago, Wisconsin-GB, UW-Milwaukee.
Ohio Valley- Murray State would be the most attractive now, but 11 of the 12 schools are public .
Sunbelt- Western Kentucky would make the most sense, and they would probably jump at the chance to get out of the Sunbelt to get into the MVC.
Click to expand...

Bemont makes sense. If they aren't the only non-football school in the OVC, they're one of two maybe. I'd also love for the league to expand to Nashville.

No way the MAC schools have any interest in the MVC.

For that matter, I see at least on MVC member leaving for the MAC in the near future.
 
Gary the Gargoyle said:
No way the MAC schools have any interest in the MVC.
Click to expand...

I agree with this, but only because they are all football schools and could not afford to give up MAC football for MVFC football.
IMO, many MAC schools would trade the MAC for the MVC if it was only for basketball. But I still believe there might be one or two of the MAC schools that would consider moving to the MVC, if they could work out a deal to still play football with the MAC.
Note that the MAC does already have an affiliate school just for football in UMass.
http://espn.go.com/blog/ncfnation/post/_/id/41083/umass-joins-mac
 
Chicago Tribune article-
http://www.chicagotribune.com/sport...lic-schools-big-east-20121213,0,3403239.story

DePaul, Marquette, Georgetown, Providence, Seton Hall, St. John's and Villanova -- are splitting from the conference. The schools are working on the details of the departure, a plan that "literally changes by the hour," a source told the Tribune.

Multiple reports Thursday said the seven schools will form a new conference and add other members that share a basketball emphasis. The Milwaukee Journal Sentinel, citing Marquette sources, said Butler and Xavier will leave the Atlantic 10 for the new conference, with Creighton, Dayton, Saint Louis and Virginia Commonwealth other candidates for membership in what would be a 10- or 12-team conference.

The only potential holdup is Georgetown struggling with the idea of leaving the Big East, the paper said.

First time I've seen Virginia Commonwealth mentioned in this discussion. Richmond, Virginia is only a little larger than the Peoria area, so they now seem to be considering non-Catholic schools that do not represent large population areas or media markets.

Also- several highly rated recruits are re-thinking their commitments to Big East schools in view of the conference fragmenting.
http://www.cbssports.com/collegebas...ts-react-to-the-big-east-split-does-it-matter
 
JMHO.... I will be disgusted if the dustle settles and BU isn't in a primarily basketball conference with like private schools. We'll need the east coast leftover A10s for this and a midwest division. Besides proximity, the MVC publics have very little in common with us. I suspect, or would hope, that Cross, the Trustees, and Glasser will use their east coast connections. We'll go with Drake and have our private school party in a room down from the Catholic schools. We wont get the suite though like them, but it will be better than kitchen scraps from the MVC remainderman.
 
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