• Welcome to BradleyFans.com! Visitors are welcome, but we encourage you to sign up and register as a member. It's free and takes only a few seconds. Just click on the link to Register at the top right of the page, and follow instructions. If you have any problems or questions, click on the link at the bottom right of the page to Contact Us.

Creighton-Iowa State controversy

tornado

tornado

New member
Creighton lost this game on a half-court (3-pointer) shot at the buzzer by Van der Beeken, but it could not be reviewed because there was no TV..
Creighton fans are emphatic they were robbed and that the shot came late..

Here is the photo the ball is still in player's hands, but light is lit on the backboard..

bilde
196499925.jpg
 
Oh great! They messed that one up BIG time! The Valley "conspiracy" continues! ;)

Seriously though, HOW do you expect replays to work without tv?! Even more curious, don't they have a camera there even without tv???!! Absolutely inexcusable!
 
we had this argument a couple weeks ago -- is it the buzzer, the clock showing 0:00, or the light on the backboard??
Nobody seems to really know -- but this shot clearly came after the light was on...homer call....
 
I hate Creighton...

Who cares, I'm happy they lost regardless of whether they got the shaft...

I can't even calculate how many calls they got when Altman was there...just recall the Woodfox last second shot in the Valley tournament that took about 4.5 seconds when there were only 2 on the clock.
 
tornado said:
we had this argument a couple weeks ago -- is it the buzzer, the clock showing 0:00, or the light on the backboard??
Nobody seems to really know -- but this shot clearly came after the light was on...homer call....
Click to expand...

The game was in Des Moines on a neutral court. ISU officials had nothing to do with the call. I agree the shot was late, but I doubt there was any ill intentions on the part of the refs. Hard to tell in real time if a shot is off in time or not.
 
tornado said:
we had this argument a couple weeks ago -- is it the buzzer, the clock showing 0:00, or the light on the backboard??
Nobody seems to really know -- but this shot clearly came after the light was on...homer call....
Click to expand...
The clock, too bad for Creighton as they always seem t6o get the breaks.
 
SaintLouBrave22 said:
I hate Creighton...

Who cares, I'm happy they lost regardless of whether they got the shaft...

I can't even calculate how many calls they got when Altman was there...just recall the Woodfox last second shot in the Valley tournament that took about 4.5 seconds when there were only 2 on the clock.
Click to expand...

Well I'm not! This is a loss that hurts the Valley even more! I'll reserve my hate of CU for during the conference season. Until then, I will root for all Valley teams to win.
 
Bravesfan said:
Well I'm not! This is a loss that hurts the Valley even more! I'll reserve my hate of CU for during the conference season. Until then, I will root for all Valley teams to win.
Click to expand...

Exactly. A valley team losing does not help anybody on selection Sunday.
So far The Valley doe not even look like they will be in the top 10 conferences in the RPI ratings.
 
tornado said:
we had this argument a couple weeks ago -- is it the buzzer, the clock showing 0:00, or the light on the backboard??
Nobody seems to really know -- but this shot clearly came after the light was on...homer call....
Click to expand...
I can tell you. It is the horn that ends the game. The light should be in sync with the horn but the horn ends the game.
 
tornado said:
we had this argument a couple weeks ago -- is it the buzzer, the clock showing 0:00, or the light on the backboard??
Nobody seems to really know -- but this shot clearly came after the light was on...homer call....
Click to expand...

It is the horn and the backboard light, which should be simultaneous.
 
Grassman said:
Exactly. A valley team losing does not help anybody on selection Sunday.
So far The Valley doe not even look like they will be in the top 10 conferences in the RPI ratings.
Click to expand...

Please let's not get into this argument again because I will cite Missouri State who didn't get in despite a strong year in the conference and an RPI of 19...

I am done caring about what others do...if you focus on your own stuff and get the job done, then who really cares what anyone else is doing?!
 
Wasn't their a story in the PJstar this summer about the Carver Arena always having a camera recording the game for instant replay even if the game wasn't on TV?

Jason
 
The MVC unfortunately is going to be a 1 bid league again this year. After a decade of multiple bids, we're going on 4 straight of a single bid. Unfortunate that the league hasn't been able to capitalize on all the tournament success of 2006. Several more opportunities for the MVC to beat the BCS are still out there (WSU takes on UConn today), but losing games to Iowa St by a league contender doesn't help anyone.
 
wily coyote said:
I can tell you. It is the horn that ends the game. The light should be in sync with the horn but the horn ends the game.
Click to expand...


OK -- I'll take the bait...

What if...

A) the horn fails? Then does the game play on and on until the horn finally sounds, even if the time reads 0:00??

b) the horn goes off prematurely as we have seen many times at the Civic Center -- does the game end right then and there even if there's time on the clock?
 
tornado said:
OK -- I'll take the bait...

What if...

A) the horn fails? Then does the game play on and on until the horn finally sounds, even if the time reads 0:00??

b) the horn goes off prematurely as we have seen many times at the Civic Center -- does the game end right then and there even if there's time on the clock?
Click to expand...

A.) In all games the bench personnel are apart of the game administration. If the horn would fail the timer might have to make a decision as to wether the shot was out of his hands when the clock went to all zeros. He would then have the timer manually hit the horn. He would then confer with the officials as to what he saw and the officials would go with his decision if neither of the three saw the sequence. Having a timer make that decision is the last thing a crew would want to do but it could happen. Not sure I've ever seen it and know I 've never had to do it but it is possible. Today with as many TV's broadcasts they would most likely try to sort it out with replay, but thats not an option in HS.

b) If the horn goes off prematurely or by accident and the ball is in play with time on the clock the officials would just tell the players to play on. If it goes off prematurely and time has expired then in college I'm sure they would try to sort it out with replay. If in HS go back to the answer in A.) Sounds more complicated then it really is. One thing to remember the horn does not kill the ball but a whistle DOES.
 
SaintLouBrave22 said:
Please let's not get into this argument again because I will cite Missouri State who didn't get in despite a strong year in the conference and an RPI of 19...

I am done caring about what others do...if you focus on your own stuff and get the job done, then who really cares what anyone else is doing?!
Click to expand...

Trust me, it matters.

Bradley would never have been in the 2006 tournament without the benefit of the MVC schools performing well in non-conference play.

If you aren't in a BCS league, you need to 1) take care of your own stuff; 2) hope your brethren take care of theirs. If there is a reason to leave a mid-major out, it will happen.

MSUs 2005-06 results

Missouri State gave them a reason by not posting a significant non-conference win.

Like it or not, BCS schools will receive the benefit of the doubt before a mid-major.
 
on cyclonefanatic..there are two guys arguing different things...
one saying that clearly in a replay he has, the horn sounded AFTER the shot regardless of when the light went on and thus, since it is the horn that matters, the shot is good.
The other guy takes issue and argues strongly that it is the clock reaching 0;00 that is the one and only thing that matters..

so I'd like to see the actual NCAA rule..direct from the NCAA Basketball Rule Book..isn't that what really matters and not just everyone's opinion...
http://www.ncaapublications.com/productdownloads/BR11.pdf

And guess what -- the 2nd guy (and what I have been contending all along)
are right!...
Except in games where NO replay is available -- or no tenths-of-a-second clock is available...

it is the CLOCK when visible in the video replay that is the final determiner of whether the shot is good or not!



Here's the rule cut and pasted from the NCAA Rule Book:

"Rule 5, Sec. 7 (page 91)
Art. 1. Each period shall begin when the ball becomes live.

Art. 2. Each period shall end when the red light or LED lights have become
activated. When the light fails to operate or is not visible, each period shall
end with the sounding of the game-clock horn.

a. In games when the red light is not present, the game-clock horn shall
terminate players’ activity.

b. In games with a 10th-of-a-second game clock display and where an
official courtside monitor is used, the reading of zeros on the game
clock is to be used to determine whether a try for goal occurred
before or after the expiration of time in any period.
When the game clock is not visible, the officials shall verify the original call
with the use of the red/LED light(s). When the red/LED light(s) are not
visible, the sounding of the game-clock horn shall be utilized. When
definitive information is unattainable with the use of the monitor, the
original call stands."


So -- to recap the official rule...the order of importance for ruling an end game shot...
-1st is the replay video of the game clock
-2nd if the clock or video are not available, then it is the lights on the backboard
-then finally, only if both those other sources are unavailable or fail, then use the horn
 
Looks like CU players should have done a better job of defending the ISU guy taking the last second 3 point shot. :idea:

From the photo in the thread, looks like he got a pretty wide open shot. :-o

Would have made the argument over the clock, horn, backboard light a moot point.

It ain't over till its over........
 
AZ BU Fan said:
Looks like CU players should have done a better job of defending the ISU guy taking the last second 3 point shot. :idea:

From the photo in the thread, looks like he got a pretty wide open shot. :-o

Would have made the argument over the clock, horn, backboard light a moot point.

It ain't over till its over........
Click to expand...

Our shooter in the picture is 6'11". Kind of hard to get a hand in his face which is why he was given the shot by Hoiberg.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top