Peoria 1A/2A basketball playoffs

[leebiddlecome]

Gotta love the 'ol Private vs. Public debate...NEVER ENDING!!!

(I am an SHG grad)

Ha. True. Redbird--I wasn't ripping on SHG or any school for that matter. I only listed private schools mentioned. I went public in high school and private in college.

We all make those choices. My point was about the cheating aspect.

 

[mrcoachdude]

I am not saying Peoria Christian cheats. I have no idea if they recruit for athletes. I do think a lot of privates do this. Some more openly than others.

I am saying this however---to say that one private 2A basketball power cheats while the other private 2A basketball power doesn't seems off-base to me.

I respect those on the board, like yourself, with ties to Peoria Christian. But we are all also coming down pretty hard on Seton Academy--while Seton Academy doesn't get the same somewhat biased representation on the board.

Is that a fair statement? That Peoria Christian is represented with greater attachement than Seton Academy?

Not sure that PCS would be in an elite group like Seton. And I am not sure that PCS is a POWER.....but they (PCS) have NOT recruited players. Their current group of kids have been together since grade school and in fact have lost a couple of players to other schools.

To have a Seton player admit to being recruited. And a Coach admittting to going and watching Jr high games to find talented players?

I am not sure I have given Seton a super hard time.....they were sure fun to watch...

 

[cpacmel]

one last example...in BOTH A and AA...50% of the schools making the finals in Scholastic Bowl were privates. This surely has to be way too many for the public school people to stomach.
Maybe it'll force them to boost the multiplier to 5.0 so the publics can compete.

http://www.ihsa.org/activity/scb/index.htm

Scholastic Bowl Finals

Class A
Chicago Latin (private)
Litchfield (public)

Class AA
Carbondale (public)
Rockford-Auburn (public)

1 of 4 is 25%

 

[leebiddlecome]

sorry, I thought it was Rockford Christian in the finals, but still a greater percentage than would be expected statistically


anyway...using the logic expressed above, how about if I made this statement..

"to say that one baseball slugger cheats using steroids while another slugger doesn't seems off-base to me"

or

"to say that one BCS school breaks thousands of recruiting rules like IU or UConn while other ones don't seems off-base to me"

Has Seton Academy been caught or punished for recruiting violations by the IHSA?

 

[leebiddlecome]

nope but I offered some pretty significant quotes and evidences that perhaps they have...while nobody has yet offered any evidence concerning PCS.

Ok then. Question answered. That's why my comments were justified. Indiana was found guilty of cheating--that's why your example didn't jive.

Im guessing if Seton Academy has cheated the IHSA would have or will have done something about it. Until then, they haven't cheated. Neither has PCS. I don't see Seton any worse than PCS in this scenario.

 

[mrcoachdude]

Ok then. Question answered. That's why my comments were justified. Indiana was found guilty of cheating--that's why your example didn't jive.

Im guessing if Seton Academy has cheated the IHSA would have or will have done something about it. Until then, they haven't cheated. Neither has PCS. I don't see Seton any worse than PCS in this scenario.

I am at a loss as to the comparison of PCS and Seton....

One (PCS) has a storied history of very good basketball coached by Fred Fox and now Jay Bruer..pretty good teams year in year out...the outstanding teams having players that learned the game from Pre-K on up at PCS

Then you have Seton who has what? Assembled a team of allstars from around the State and good how many years.......1 so far...

I am not sure if the IHSA has looked or will look into Seton.....I am sure I do not care all that much...but to say they are one in the same.......

 

[leebiddlecome]

I am at a loss as to the comparison of PCS and Seton....

One (PCS) has a storied history of very good basketball coached by Fred Fox and now Jay Bruer..pretty good teams year in year out...the outstanding teams having players that learned the game from Pre-K on up at PCS

Then you have Seton who has what? Assembled a team of allstars from around the State and good how many years.......1 so far...

I am not sure if the IHSA has looked or will look into Seton.....I am sure I do not care all that much...but to say they are one in the same.......

You're opinions come from a view connected to PCS. Mine do not. Obviously we won't see everything the same in that regard. When someone is closely connected to something--compared to an outsider--the two people will have differing views.

I am an outsider. No ties either way. As an objective, outside observer I see two private, 2A schools who had very good basketball teams. Neither team has been found guilty of any wrongdoing. With those facts in mind they are very much the same.

 

[mrcoachdude]

You're opinions come from a view connected to PCS. Mine do not. Obviously we won't see everything the same in that regard. When someone is closely connected to something--compared to an outsider--the two people will have differing views.

I am an outsider. No ties either way. As an objective, outside observer I see two private, 2A schools who had very good basketball teams. Neither team has been found guilty of any wrongdoing. With those facts in mind they are very much the same.

I am still at a loss...what is there to see? Facts are facts. If you do not believe me then that is a different issue all together...

1. Seton had a team full of transfers, is good this year and the future will be relied upon transfers.
2. PCS had no transfers and has a history of good teams.

How is that the same? Not pointing to guilt...but it is not the same..

 

[leebiddlecome]

I am still at a loss...what is there to see? Facts are facts. If you do not believe me then that is a different issue all together...

1. Seton had a team full of transfers, is good this year and the future will be relied upon transfers.
2. PCS had no transfers and has a history of good teams.

How is that the same? Not pointing to guilt...but it is not the same..

If one college team goes to the Final Four and has a roster full of recruited, four-year kids and another team goes to the Final Four filled with mostly JUCO's and other D1 transfers are they different?

I don't know. Obviously they are different schools--but one isn't any "better" or "worse" than the other. I just thought it was off base to imply Seton has cheated when there hasn't been any proof of that by the IHSA.

 

[mrcoachdude]

apples and oranges on the college stuff.......

One of their coaches was quoted as saying he went to Jr High games to watch prospective players.....that is against the rules.....cheating....

 

[leebiddlecome]

Not the same, because colleges are not only allowed to recruit...they have to, they rely on it..
while high schools are all strictly prohibited from recruiting for athletic purposes.

so my answer is that yes, this is different from the high school situation - and if you conceding Seton did recruit those kids into transferring (like the Final Four team of D1 Transfers), then you have suggested yourself that they are rulebreakers.

Im not conceding they have. I just haven't understood the obsession to put them down for the way they supposedly do things. Until proven, they aren't doing anything any other school couldn't do.

It doesn't make them any worse or better than PCS or any other school for that matter.

 

[mrcoachdude]

Im not conceding they have. I just haven't understood the obsession to put them down for the way they supposedly do things. Until proven, they aren't doing anything any other school couldn't do.

It doesn't make them any worse or better than PCS or any other school for that matter.

oh they are better than PCS for sure....they are the State Champs....

did you see my previous post?

 

[leebiddlecome]

oh they are better than PCS for sure....they are the State Champs....

did you see my previous post?

I meant as far as how they are judged "morally" with how they get players, etc. I know they are better from a basketball standpoint

 

[mrcoachdude]

I meant as far as how they are judged "morally" with how they get players, etc. I know they are better from a basketball standpoint

QUESTION: Will you be attending a lot of elementary school games this year and checking out their players
for possible enrollment at Seton?

ANSWER: Coach Thomas: As many as possible. It??™s not always easy to attend during the season,
but anytime there is an opportunity to evaluate young players, I will be in a gym somewhere!"


lee....this is against IHSA rules....

Of Seton??™s five starters, two ??” seniors DJ Cooper and Jordan Walker ??” transferred from Chicago Hales Franciscan. Another starter, junior Khameron Harper, transferred from Chicago Simeon. Another, Walker transferred to Hales from Champaign Central.

amazing talent.......

 

[leebiddlecome]

QUESTION: Will you be attending a lot of elementary school games this year and checking out their players
for possible enrollment at Seton?

ANSWER: Coach Thomas: As many as possible. It??™s not always easy to attend during the season,
but anytime there is an opportunity to evaluate young players, I will be in a gym somewhere!"


lee....this is against IHSA rules....

Of Seton??™s five starters, two ??” seniors DJ Cooper and Jordan Walker ??” transferred from Chicago Hales Franciscan. Another starter, junior Khameron Harper, transferred from Chicago Simeon. Another, Walker transferred to Hales from Champaign Central.

amazing talent.......

Im guessing the IHSA has heard about Seton Academy all along and are/will do its due diligence. If its against the IHSA rules then I would think some punishment would have been handed down....wouldn't you?

It's not like this board is the only place that follows what Seton Academy does. Until the IHSA finds them of wrongdoing then, well, lets leave it be.

 

[mrcoachdude]

Im guessing the IHSA has heard about Seton Academy all along and are/will do its due diligence. If its against the IHSA rules then I would think some punishment would have been handed down....wouldn't you?

It's not like this board is the only place that follows what Seton Academy does. Until the IHSA finds them of wrongdoing then, well, lets leave it be.

no problem with the leave it be...but lets leave PCS out of the equal to equation.....

they are not the same......