Possible Winning Lineup For The Braves

[RaiderOfBradley]

Hello all,

After the last few games without Ruffin, I think I have come up with a good lineup that would provide us with strong offense, good defense and solid rebounding for the foreseeable future. How about:

PG- Sam Maniscalco
SG- Jeremy Crouch
SF- Andrew Warren
PF- Sam Singh
PF- Matt Salley

Sixth Man- Theron Wilson
Big Man Backup- David Collins/Rashad Austin
Guard Backup- Tyrone Cole-Scott (pref. at point)

With this lineup, Crouch and Warren would be the major shooters. Maniscalco can contribute around to all while contributing points. Singh adds defense and rebounding and his points will be gravy. Salley will add points, can put him on the opposing PF and Singh on the center on defense.

Wilson (and/or Cole-Scott, they might be interchangeable) would provide an immediate spark on offense as the first man off the bench (depending on the situation who goes in). Collins/Austin will be excellent backups for Singh and Salley.

Comments?

 

[mrcoachdude]

what would these last two games have been like without SamM......

 

[Scouter]

Singh is a big body, but I honestly can't see trading him for Wilson in the starting lineup and seeing that as an upgrade in rebounding. Sam's lack of athleticism, IMO, is the biggest reason he isn't part of the starting five. He matches up well against big dinosaurs down low like Missouri State has, but him against someone more mobile like Coleman or Falker is a terrible mismatch.

 

[ER3]

Hello all,

After the last few games without Ruffin, I think I have come up with a good lineup that would provide us with strong offense, good defense and solid rebounding for the foreseeable future. How about:

PG- Sam Maniscalco
SG- Jeremy Crouch
SF- Andrew Warren
PF- Sam Singh
PF- Matt Salley

Comments?

I may be in the minority..but I really think that our current starting lineup (SM, AW, JC, TW, and MS) is about the best we can do...
I know when we are in a losing streak it is sometimes necessary to feel like you have to make changes for the sake of making changes, but I think your lineup above would have a really, really hard time generating much offense...

The reason I say that is that without Ruff we have absolutely no one in the starting lineup (other than Theron) that is a threat at all to penetrate and get the ball to the rim...and I think you have to have that presence there on the floor or the other team will have way too easy of a time defending you.
Theron didn't have a great line in the boxscore against MSU, but he did have a number of nice penetration moves where we was able to beat his man and get to the rim...Now, he didn't finish most of those plays, but I think it is very important that you have him on the floor with his slashing ability to at least give a threat of penetration and maybe some inside-out passes for open looks...
With AW, SM, JC, SS, and MS all in the game, I think the defense wouldn't have to respect anyone's slashing ability and it would be tough for us to get any good looks from the perimeter as a result...
If Ruff were playing, he would give us that slashing dimension that might allow us to be more flexible with the rest of the lineup...but without him, I think you almost have to have TW in the starting lineup...

 

[Scouter]

I agree, ER3. Those are our best five players at the moment. I can't really see another combo that would warrant more PT.

 

[real fan]

Major problem with those 5 players is we are not winning and that is with Sam M. and Andrew Warren having good games last night; as far as Sam Singh not being able to guard Coleman; I think that statement is a joke as he did not play in that game and Coleman had a huge night so I don"t think he could have done any worse; Singh adds a lot more then he gets credit for and his stats per mins. played back that up;he doesn"t have to be the fastest one down the court as his job is to rebound on defense and get the ball to one of our guards; he is by far our best post player on offense. When you score 80 points o0n the road you should win and by looking at our stats we lost because Missouri State had way too many offensive rebounds; starting 6-5 and 6-7 players as our tallest inside people is not the answer to being able to compete on the boards.

 

[Scouter]

as far as Sam Singh not being able to guard Coleman; I think that statement is a joke as he did not play in that game and Coleman had a huge night so I don"t think he could have done any worse

Did you ever think that's the reason he didn't play? Anyone with any good footwork or athleticism, IMO, would take Singh to town.

I don't think it's any coincidence that Sam saw more quality minutes against Michigan State (Naymick and Suton) and Missouri State (Richards) than UNI and Coleman.

 

[houstontxbrave]

I do not care who does or doesnt start, I want someone, anyone to step up and get defensive rebounds and limit the second, third, fourth etc possessions this team gives up constantly and for our guards to stop turning the basketball at our alarming rate.

Someone mentioned how disappointed they were the SM got into it late in the game with one of MSU players. I am glad he did atleast it shows he cares and is sick of losing. It would be real nice to see some of our other players get a real mean streak in them and if it means knocking someone on their A** then do it.

 

[ER3]

...as far as Sam Singh not being able to guard Coleman; I think that statement is a joke as he did not play in that game...

Sam Singh cannot guard Eric Coleman 1-on-1...Sorry, not a chance...No knock on Sam...I'm pretty sure he would agree with that statement.

...we lost because Missouri State had way too many offensive rebounds; starting 6-5 and 6-7 players as our tallest inside people is not the answer to being able to compete on the boards.

People need to stop using this excuse that the reason we don't rebound well is because we are too small...that is NOT the reason. That's just a crutch people use...We rebound poorly because we are soft as a team and the concept of blocking out appears to be a completely foreign concept to the players.
And if you are still convinced that the reason that we are 'not able to compete on the boards' is because we are small...go ahead and take a look at the players on Missouri State that were getting all of those offensive rebounds against us last night. To support your theory they must have been a bunch of 7-footers, right? Umm, no...Lamberth had 7 offensive rebounds and 16 total rebounds and he is 6'5" and weighs less than Jeremy Crouch...Deven Mitchell is 6'5" and he got 3 offensive rebounds...Dex Manswell is 6'7" and got 3 offensive boards...Heck, Shane Laurie who is 6'1" pushed Salley out under the hoop and got one offensive rebound...It's not the size that got all of those rebounds for Missouri State...Three guys on Missouri State that are the same size as Crouch, Warren, and Salley, combined to get 16 offensive boards last night...Size wasn't our problem on the boards that night...having the desire to rebound and understanding how to be consistently successful at it...those were our problems...

 

[audacious_aficionado]

i could not agree more ER3. our problem isn't our size, it's our desire to grab the ball!

PS- wilson is an excellent rebounder and taking him out of the starting 5 to improve rebounding is a joke!

 

[amckillip]

i could not agree more ER3. our problem isn't our size, it's our desire to grab the ball!

PS- wilson is an excellent rebounder and taking him out of the starting 5 to improve rebounding is a joke!

These two statements pretty much sum it up. We need fire, we don't have it, Sam is the only player I've seen have it the last couple of games. AW at TW RARLEY.

I am open however, to seeing less of JC. He's our senior leader now and he hasn't shown that. I think it's time to do something a. la. Cellus. I'm sure it's not for lack of effort or hard work, I don't think thats ever been a problem with JC, but I think maybe it's time for him to get mad. Make him want to be on that court so much that he fights harder on defense and works harder to get a good break off screens. I don't think we can take him out of the starting line-up, we just don't have that option, He's in our top 4 players any time. I just hope SamM can keep it up(I think he can), and maybe that will open up things a little for JC. I think TW is key though, we need him to score the way he can and focus more on boards.

 

[TNel]

Who starts and who doesn't is WAY over-rated. After 40 minutes, it's who made the most of the minutes they played. Our starters pitched a 13 - 0 shutout last game. How do you improve on that?

 

[Les is More]

I agree, ER3. Those are our best five players at the moment. I can't really see another combo that would warrant more PT.

It is not the best 5 players that should play. it is the 5 players that mold together the best that should be playing on the court.

For instance with the Bulls, Ben Gordon sees his roll as a 6th man, which he thrives in. He is one of their best players, but he doesnt help the team out as much in the starting lineup

 

[wily coyote]

It is not the best 5 players that should play. it is the 5 players that mold together the best that should be playing on the court.

For instance with the Bulls, Ben Gordon sees his roll as a 6th man, which he thrives in. He is one of their best players, but he doesnt help the team out as much in the starting lineup

I agree with you abouting molding together. It is very important. WE have not found the right mix yet. Since we pretty trashed that stupid weave last game, I would like to se us go big. Sammy M & JC at guards, TW @ the 3, Sam S at the 4 and DC or RA at the 5. Maybe not much D ,but i'll bet we wouldn't get KILLED on the boards. Won't ever happen but I would like to see this combination on the floor at the same time. Hope we forget the weave again Sat.

 

[ph]

I've been playing around with season average production per minute * minutes played.
Last game we scored 80 points and had 33 rebounds.
If our players had average point and rebound production per minute last game we would of only scored 69.1 and had 31.2 boards. So we actually got above average rebounding and point production from the last game.

I've tried to put together a common-sense lineup to maximize points and rebounds per game, but cannot. (Sam M is near the bottom (only TCS is worse) of the team in season combined points + rebounds per 40 minutes. so every lineup with a point guard remains about what we had vs UNI)

The best total of points scored and rebounds per game would be 40 minutes of AW, TW, MS, DC and SS for 75.8 points and 48.5 rebounds.

Here's the season average of points+rebounds per minute * 40 minutes:
Ruffin, Daniel..... 22.7
Crouch, Jeremy..... 19.4
Warren, Andrew.....22.3
Wilson, Theron..... 22.1
Maniscalco, Sam.... 15.0
Salley, Matt....... 21.8
Collins, David..... 29.7
Cole-Scott, Tyrone.13.5
Singh, Sam......... 28.4
Egolf, Will........ 17.6
Austin, Rashad.....**** 21.3

 

[Scouter]

I am open however, to seeing less of JC. He's our senior leader now and he hasn't shown that. I think it's time to do something a. la. Cellus. I'm sure it's not for lack of effort or hard work, I don't think thats ever been a problem with JC, but I think maybe it's time for him to get mad. Make him want to be on that court so much that he fights harder on defense and works harder to get a good break off screens. I don't think we can take him out of the starting line-up, we just don't have that option, He's in our top 4 players any time. I just hope SamM can keep it up(I think he can), and maybe that will open up things a little for JC. I think TW is key though, we need him to score the way he can and focus more on boards.

I understand your point, but anyone who's talked to JC knows he's one of the most mild-mannered guys out there. There are such things as quiet leaders out there, and I think he's more of someone who leads by example than by emotion (see: his work between his sophomore and junior years and this off-season after surgery).

Also, JC is our biggest 3-point threat and seeing as how we're a 3-point shooting team, we can't really afford to take him off the floor.

 

[LG281]

...seeing as how we're a 3-point shooting team, we can't really afford to take him off the floor.

CORRECTION: We WERE a three point shooting team LAST YEAR. This team has its own identity (they just haven't figured out what that is yet).

I for one would like to see Crouch coming off the bench. I'd also like to see someone other than Sammy follow his shot.

 

[ph]

In terms of average points and rebounds per minute, JC is 8th on this team.
However, without DR, JC is #2 among our guards in points per minute.

Based on season averages, the only way you can gain anything without JC is by going big to pickup more rebounds. and having the same average # of points scored.

How about:
Player Min. Points Rebounds
Crouch, Jeremy..... 15 5.8 1.5
Warren, Andrew.....30 13.4 3.4
Wilson, Theron..... 35 11.0 8.3
Maniscalco, Sam....35 10.5 2.7
Salley, Matt....... 20 5.2 5.7
Collins, David..... 20 8.8 6.0
Cole-Scott, Tyrone 5 1.4 0.3
Singh, Sam......... 20 8.6 5.6
Austin, Rashad.....****20 4.3 6.4
-
Total 200 69.0 39.7
That is only .1 points lower than season average and 8.6 boards more.

 

[real fan]

When you talk about our lack of offensive rebounding there is a good reason why we do not get many offensive putbacks under our basket as we take so many 3 point shots that when you miss the ball will usually come out longer; Missouri State had Lamberth,Mitchell, and Richards inside for the better part of the game which is why they were able to rebound better then us; compare those 3 to Salley, Wilson and Crouch and you have the reason for why they killed us on the boards.

 

[ph]

When you talk about our lack of offensive rebounding there is a good reason why we do not get many offensive putbacks under our basket as we take so many 3 point shots that when you miss the ball will usually come out longer; Missouri State had Lamberth,Mitchell, and Richards inside for the better part of the game which is why they were able to rebound better then us; compare those 3 to Salley, Wilson and Crouch and you have the reason for why they killed us on the boards.

Since Wilson and Salley are currently #1 and 2 in boards/minute playes,
I'm starting to think that the most do-able, noticable improvement this team could possibly make is Crouch concentrating more on the boards and upping his production to 6-8 boards a game (currently averages 3.3). He is smart enough to be able to make that adjustment. The new guys are adjusting to enough, already.