tornado said:
We had some discussion on the PJ Star board a couple years ago and I recall the coverage that confirmed McDermott had not seen the Germans.
There were also a couple articles detailing how odd and unexpected it was to Dunham and Davis and even their coaches, that McDermott would offer a full scholarship to guys he had never been to see, and had even never contacted prior to seeing them at a summer camp.
Most of what I have said about those guys was from articles directly quoting them and McDermott.
If that isn't a definition of offering "early" then I don't know what is, and Eglseder was offered way early before he ever played HS ball.
I just questioned the logic of offering kids you haven't evaluated much if at all.
In the end, most of those kids never panned out, or never made it to UNI, and of the two who did, I don't think you'd deny that really only one has much of a chance of ever playing much.
Dunham is a project, needed redshirting, and is somewhat suspect.
I did some digging and found probably 6-8 examples of colleges offering kids who are still freshman........so indeed it is exceedingly RARE....and NO COACH really has ever done it more than one time as an extreme oddity, while McD has done it several times.
Bruce Weber just did it, and so did Tim Floyd. But in all those other cases the kid is a 4 or 5 star recruit that the coach is locking in on early!
But I have pointed out now that McDermott has done it several times.........it is essentially a pattern, and I have noted that most of those early offers didn't pan out.
We'll have to wait another 4-5 years to see if the 2 offers to Iowa freshmen pan out, but several years ago, I was saying the same thing about Dunham, Davis, Raffington, etc...and bingo...
Thanks for the reply. All I can tell you is what I know as a first hand Panther fan. I guess you could look at PJ Star discussion boards, but I don't think you will find a better source than myself, and that's not a self righteous statement by any means, but just an opinion. I know for a fact that Mac saw Jermain Raffington before offering him...b/c I happened to be watching the basketball camp that he was playing in. As for Vince, it's debatable whether Mac saw him play, even though his team played in the US prior to signing, but I'm sure there was at least one coach that saw him play, and at least some game tape viewed.
I never disputed the fact that Mac has offered guys early. I just corrected your statement in which you mentioned that Mac has offered numerous kids 3-4 years early while at UNI and none of them panned out. Jordan Eglseder is a fantastic recruit. He had all the big boys on him. He went to Nike Camp:
http://cbs.sportsline.com/collegebasketball/story/8638846/rss and I remember reading an article where the summer before his senior year he kept getting pressure from various Big Ten, Big East, etc... to decommit.
As for Kerwin, he was surprised by the offer, just like several student-athletes are surprised when they get their first offer. Kerwin's article here states:
http://www.panthernation.com/archive/index.php?t-218.html
"It was very unexpected," Dunham said of the scholarship offer from Northern Iowa coach Greg McDermott. "I was surprised."
For the record, Kerwin was a 20 PPG scorer as a sophomore in HS. He finished his career with over 2,000 points. He redshirted his freshman year. Would you say that every kid who redshirts his freshman year is a project? Boy, I don't think so.
As for Davis, I will concede (which I have before) that Mac hadn't, or probably hadn't seen him play prior to offering him at UNI Big Man Camp. However, he was going to be a senior in HS and his scholarship was filled by the fall signing period just 5 months later.
So, I guess my beef isn't with the fact that Mac has been aggressive in getting guys to come to UNI early, but rather the lack of facts that are in your posts that come off as 'factual comments' to the average reader. Mac only offered one kid 3 years early while at UNI...his name was Jordan Eglseder. He's a very good talent, and will be a big time player before he leaves UNI...I have no doubt in my mind. Mac got a commit from only one kid prior to his junior year (academically) while at UNI. His name is Kerwin Dunham, a future 2,000 point scorer in the state of Iowa, and a RS freshman...in which you state he is 'a project, and is somewhat suspect'. Now, is Kerwin an all-MVC kid? Maybe...maybe not, but that's irrelevant right now. You're basically writing him off as a RS freshman. Not every kid is signed with the vision of him being a MVC POY. Now, that would be great, but it's unrealistic.
As for offering guys early, and being a pattern. Yes, McDermott does offer kids earlier than most schools. While at UNI, he offered several kids during their junior year of HS (McKowen---4 year PG, Josten---will be a 2 yr starter, Viet---best 3 pt shooter on the team, but has been injury prone, Ben Jacobson---4 year starter, Kwadzo Ahelgbe---started 6 games as a freshman, and Barz as a junior---will be a freshman next season, also will most likely RS due to the quality on the front line next season (Iowa's Gatorade POY). But, he did that at UNI for a reason. He had to take some educated risks on kids. UNI was not at the stature it is now when he took the job. He offered Eglseder prior to going to the NCAA Tourney, Dunham after the 1st one, McKowen/Viet/Josten prior to going to one (as juniors in HS), Ahelgbe during the 2nd year run. He couldn't offer prestige, history, or playing time, but he could get on kids early and develop a relationship with them and woo them to UNI. It worked, and we'll see if it works at ISU.
Last point, you mention things not working out for Davis, Dunham (which it's WAY too early to call his status), Raffington, etc...
Davis, I agree. Mac offered early, and it didn't work out. BUT, things were taken care of before the signing period and another scholy was offered to another student-athlete.
Raffington, even though he didn't end up at UNI, he's going to Butler next year after two solid seasons at Southeastern CC. His talent is D1, but his grades/test score was just shy of the requirement (something that isn't always known about players prior to signing them). Raffington, however, was seen playing prior to Mac offering him. He came to UNI's camp, and he played on two teams that played in the US at a HS tourney in Bristol, TN. But, let's remember, again, Raffington was going to be a senior in HS...not early.
And as for the "etc...", I can't remember any other debatable offers that went to kids who were sophs/juniors or maybe weren't observed in a HS game prior to a scholy offer (except Polakovic which has already been discussed?).
So, after the story has gone from 'early' meaning '3-4 years early', it went to 'prior to seeing them play' (allegedly). So, hopefully, I have shed a little more light on the recruiting situation at UNI the past 5 years. As for ISU in the future, I don't know. I don't follow it too closely, but I can tell you that at UNI you didn't see Mac offering 4 and 5 star recruits b/c the UNI name dropped kids stocks more than improve them, and he offered mainly Iowa kids early...which also rarely brings the rise to 4 star status by Rivals and Scout.[/url]
Adam Viet has the best 3 point shooting shot on the team. Unfortunately, he has been riddled by injuries. When UNI was on a roll early this year, Viet was the man that was coming off the bench to hit the big 3's to get the momentum rolling. He led the team in scoring twice last season, something no other non-started did for UNI last year.