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Donivine Stewart leaving Bradley

Buesch N Chips said:
I think we need to try to be more positive and optimistic. And I said the same thing last year. I'm not a fan of the negative nellies.

I think there is a way to express concern without coming off as a spinmeister, or as an attacker.
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B & C not sure where your coming from with this post. I was just having a little fun with T. My post had nothing to do with negativity or attacking anyone. Not sure where you got that impression. I will give you credit, you have for the most part been very positive but I was in no way being negative towards the program. I like the direction we're going but I didn't get that feeling from T's post even though I know he wants us to succeed.
 
wily coyote said:
B & C not sure where your coming from with this post. I was just having a little fun with T. My post had nothing to do with negativity or attacking anyone. Not sure where you got that impression. I will give you credit, you have for the most part been very positive but I was in no way being negative towards the program. I like the direction we're going but I didn't get that feeling from T's post even though I know he wants us to succeed.
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My point was more directed at T. I think most of the time his posts are fine, but his laundry list of all things negative from this season struck me as something that wasn't very optimistic. I am perfectly fine with expressing pointed concerns about a lack of shooting or a JP's performance or whatever, but the wide sweeping criticisms of team results, when GF obviously is trying to fit a roster to a system, are pretty pointless at this point. In my opinion.
 
tornado said:
I think we have somewhat debunked the theory or argument that NO KID will ever do well or help his team unless he does so well in practice as to deserve playing time...
There are plenty of exceptions...

One other thread gave many such examples of kids who were so deep in the playing rotation that they never saw the court yet were really good once they got the chance.

so you can believe that argument and maybe it's true much of the time - but it certainly is NOT true ALL the time...how will you ever know unless the kid gets the chance..
As I pointed out in one other thread, the only THREE times DS was on the court for more than a minute or two he actually performed well, even scored well once and never turned the ball over!

here's just one more example...

Just prior to WIU's and Jim Molinari's first post-season game ever - their game against Oregon in the CBI -- Mo had one kid clean out his locker & quit and two other kids were unavailable...

So he was forced to play really shorthanded...
so Mo was forced to use a kid named Don McAvoy - a kid who was so deep in the playing rotation that even in games where Mo needed MORE depth - McAvoy still barely saw the floor.

But - McAvoy came off the bench and scored 19 points and played great on both the defense and offensive ends of the floor and was the PLAYER of the GAME for WIU and even Mo said after the game that McAvoy's performance surprised him.
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ok so is the McAvoy kid actually good..........or was it one game
 
Buesch N Chips said:
My point was more directed at T. I think most of the time his posts are fine, but his laundry list of all things negative from this season struck me as something that wasn't very optimistic. I am perfectly fine with expressing pointed concerns about a lack of shooting or a JP's performance or whatever, but the wide sweeping criticisms of team results, when GF obviously is trying to fit a roster to a system, are pretty pointless at this point. In my opinion.
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Sorry B&C I mistook what you were saying. I agree I thought someone hijacked T's account. Very not like him to post that way and that's why i kiddingly suggested he might get the axe and have to post OTOB. LOL
 
Boiler said:
....That really makes no sense. Coaches play the players that they feel give them the best chance to win basketball games. Donivine wasn't one of those players.
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When you're the new coach of a last place team, there is no expectation to win in your first year. You can do whatever you please, including Creaning players that don't fit your system. I don't necessarily blame Geno for this - he has an idea of what the team should look like. So even though Donivine could have helped this year, he wasn't in Geno's long term plans, and needed to be removed. Never playing him is the easiest way to accomplish this. Geno sacrificed a small amount this season for future seasons (small amount because it's not like DS would elevate us to a contender). Let's hope it pays off.
 
AE Braves Fan said:
When you're the new coach of a last place team, there is no expectation to win in your first year. You can do whatever you please, including Creaning players that don't fit your system. I don't necessarily blame Geno for this - he has an idea of what the team should look like. So even though Donivine could have helped this year, he wasn't in Geno's long term plans, and needed to be removed. Never playing him is the easiest way to accomplish this. Geno sacrificed a small amount this season for future seasons (small amount because it's not like DS would elevate us to a contender). Let's hope it pays off.
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Here's a crazy thought. Maybe, just maybe, Donivine wasn't good enough to play at this level.

Seems to be a more sensible explanation than your convoluted conspiracy theory.
 
AE Braves Fan said:
When you're the new coach of a last place team, there is no expectation to win in your first year. You can do whatever you please, including Creaning players that don't fit your system. I don't necessarily blame Geno for this - he has an idea of what the team should look like. So even though Donivine could have helped this year, he wasn't in Geno's long term plans, and needed to be removed. Never playing him is the easiest way to accomplish this. Geno sacrificed a small amount this season for future seasons (small amount because it's not like DS would elevate us to a contender). Let's hope it pays off.
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That is fantasy land thinking. No way does a new coach come in and purposely keep players on the bench who are good enough to help. Coaches are just as competitive as players and will do what they have to to win games. It does not matter one bit that it is Geno's first year. To imply that Geno or any new coach pulls the reigns back on his best players to run some off is nonsense.

This is not some YMCA rec league team you sign up for and get guaranteed playing time. Does not matter one bit that DS had a good high school numbers and is a local star. Charron Woods was the first guard off the bench for a reason. And its not because Geno wanted to Crean DS.

Just curious here....did you ever see Stewart in person during his high school career? What was it you thought he did well enough as a high school senior that led you to believe he could contribute his freshman year at our level? Or are you just repeating a few talking points of a couple posters who thought he was a sure thing at Bradley?
 
BuB said:
Just curious here....did you ever see Stewart in person during his high school career? What was it you thought he did well enough as a high school senior that led you to believe he could contribute his freshman year at our level? Or are you just repeating a few talking points of a couple posters who thought he was a sure thing at Bradley?
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I saw him, he was a beast in the Mid Illini, but he was nowhere NEAR DSE when he played for Washington.
 
BuB said:
Just curious here....did you ever see Stewart in person during his high school career? ..
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here's another thought...and I don't claim to know more than a D-I coach but I have been watching D-I ball over 40 years.

of course nobody on this board sees the players in practice -- but hey - we do see the players on the floor playing against real competition..

so why does it take about 25 games of starting the exact same starting five - and losing almost all of them before someone finally figures out - after weeks of the folks on the message board saying we should try a different starting five or juggling the lineup- then suddenly - almost as if someone listened to the message boards - we have a different starting five!

Now - I'm not going to say making the lineup changes suddenly made us a juggernaut - but...
we did go from 5 different 23-30 point blowouts - including back-to-back 30-pt blowouts to Evansville & ISU...
to Jalen Crawford hitting 3-4 from 3-pt range and scoring 9 pts in his very FIRST start and ending a 6 game losing streak --
From that point on - the next six games were FAR more competitive and most were within single digits instead of 30-pt blowouts.
Sure - we didn't win much but we were DEFINITELY more competitive and the fans saw it!!
The average home attendance after we made that change was unexpectedly way better...

all I am saying - is that if you are going to use the argument that ONLY the coaches can see what's happening in practice - then you would HAVE to make the SAME assessment that the coaches surely must see what's happening in games, too, right??
I am just offering proof that some fans also are astute enough to see what's working and what is NOT working and be able to comeup with some ideas of what would help.
The fans called this one several games before it happened - that we SHOULD and would change the lineup and be more competitive, and that's exactly what happened.
 
tornado said:
here's another thought...and I don't claim to know more than a D-I coach but I have been watching D-I ball over 40 years.

of course nobody on this board sees the players in practice -- but hey - we do see the players on the floor playing against real competition..

so why does it take about 25 games of starting the exact same starting five - and losing almost all of them before someone finally figures out - after weeks of the folks on the message board saying we should try a different starting five or juggling the lineup- then suddenly - almost as if someone listened to the message boards - we have a different starting five!

Now - I'm not going to say making the lineup changes suddenly made us a juggernaut - but...
we did go from 5 different 23-30 point blowouts - including back-to-back 30-pt blowouts to Evansville & ISU...
to Jalen Crawford hitting 3-4 from 3-pt range and scoring 9 pts in his very FIRST start and ending a 6 game losing streak --
From that point on - the next six games were FAR more competitive and most were within single digits instead of 30-pt blowouts.
Sure - we didn't win much but we were DEFINITELY more competitive and the fans saw it!!
The average home attendance after we made that change was unexpectedly way better...

all I am saying - is that if you are going to use the argument that ONLY the coaches can see what's happening in practice - then you would HAVE to make the SAME assessment that the coaches surely must see what's happening in games, too, right??
I am just offering proof that some fans also are astute enough to see what's working and what is NOT working and be able to comeup with some ideas of what would help.
The fans called this one several games before it happened - that we SHOULD and would change the lineup and be more competitive, and that's exactly what happened.
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Ok, let's try this one, I'm not a coach but I did stay at a Holiday Inn Express last night.
 
tornado said:
here's another thought...
so why does it take about 25 games of starting the exact same starting five - and losing almost all of them before someone finally figures out -
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Defense tornado. Defense. If you listened to Coach Ford and Crawford you would know that DEFENSE was the reason Crawford did not start or get as much PT. If you watched those last few games of the year you would know that DEFENSE was the reason that Bradley suddenly became competitive again. It was obvious that the this team that Coach Ford inherited FINALLY "bought in" (where have we heard that term before? ;) ) to what the coaching staff had been preaching all year. Let's hope this carries over to next season. We'll need that commitment to defense if we have any hope of improving on our record.
 
Hate seeing us try to diminish Stewarts skills. It did not work out for him here and I hope he does well at SIU-E. He still put his nose to the grindstone and came out with very good grades, and by all accounts worked hard in practice. Best of luck DS...


:)
 
BuB said:
...Just curious here....did you ever see Stewart in person during his high school career? What was it you thought he did well enough as a high school senior that led you to believe he could contribute his freshman year at our level? Or are you just repeating a few talking points of a couple posters who thought he was a sure thing at Bradley?
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I saw him play several times. I sat next to coaches Les and Vogt during a Pekin holiday tournament and watched several of Donivine's games. He was slow and was often hidden on defense in their zone. However, he can also handle the ball better than anyone on BU, and he can score.
 
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