sporting news -very preseason top 25

[SycamoreFanatic]

Sure there is some ISU Fandom in those statements. Those Bulldoggies stopped playing the Sycamores an alternate home & home when they refused to play in the Hulman Center two years ago when it was their turn to play in the Hulman Center resulting in a 100 yr. old series going on the shelf.

But mark my word or this post or whatever. They will not in the foreseeable future attain the same heights as this past year's team and will struggle mightily next season to even get into the Dance. They would be a regular 3rd or 4th place team in the Valley every year, not a team getting into the dance from a crummy league year after year.

 

[Future Walk-On]

OK whatever and Duke was not the best team in America either. Butler had to be considered on of the top 8 teams in the nation last year and with that anything is possible. Who was the top team anyway. I thought playing the games determined that???

playing one game in the tournament and winning doesn't prove anything...playing for a chance to make it to their home town to the final four...they were jacked.

EDIT: Kansas
Syracuse
Kansas State
Villanova
Duke
Ohio State
Michigan State
West Virginia
Kentucky

which of those teams would you put Butler ahead of jw.

 

[amckillip]

Sure there is some ISU Fandom in those statements. Those Bulldoggies stopped playing the Sycamores an alternate home & home when they refused to play in the Hulman Center two years ago when it was their turn to play in the Hulman Center resulting in a 100 yr. old series going on the shelf.

But mark my word or this post or whatever. They will not in the foreseeable future attain the same heights as this past year's team and will struggle mightily next season to even get into the Dance. They would be a regular 3rd or 4th place team in the Valley every year, not a team getting into the dance from a crummy league year after year.

I would put money on the fact that no more than 2 teams reach the heights that Butler did last season... So good observation.

 

[Indy_BB]

Nice to see WSU ranked as they should be the favorites for next season. But absolutely ridiculous to see Butler ranked that low! Even without Hayward they should be a top 10 caliber team.

Rivals has Butler at 13.

Related...

All three players that Butler added in 2010 are rated by various services, with two players in the Rivals 150 (Marshall and Hopkins) - (KM is rated by pretty much everyone though) and another (Fromm) who is in the MaxPreps Top 100 (Marshall in there too).

Rivals' Brian Snow has said Chrishawn Hopkins is the best athlete in the 2010 class. Here is an example.

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And, why in the world would Butler play Indiana State? Butler doesn't play IUPUI or IPFW either. There is no benefit in playing such programs, outside of a one-off scenario. The level of absurdity in attempting to criticize the schedule of a program that actually played the most difficult OOC-schedule in America, is next level stuff - LOL

 

[TheAsianSensation]

And, why in the world would Butler play Indiana State?

Because that's been a yearly series for apparently forever. I don't have means to fact-check that, but if an above post is true, I'd be pretty ticked if a series that has been around for that many years is ended.

But in any event, Butler is now Gonzaga. They can get whatever game they want, outside of a marquee name inside Hinkle, and even then they probably can still get a couple. They've ascended.

 

[LittleBrave]

College hoops is just crazy - who knows if Butler won't get back to the Final 4 in the next few seasons? Not many teams are as poised as Butler, with a core of young players who play like upper-classmen.
Their only disadvantage is playing in the Horizon, which may not prepare them like other teams in better conferences. But other major programs want to play them, just like Gonzaga, because a win vs. them is a quality win, and a loss doesn't hurt them that much. So their non-conf. schedule might get them to play well together quicker than other teams.
Anyways, I wouldn't be surprised to see Butler in the Final Four next year or the year after, but they could just as easily lose before the Sweet 16.
But the one thing is that they'll hang around in just about every game vs. the Big Boys, and they have an outstanding head coach.

 

[SFP]

playing one game in the tournament and winning doesn't prove anything...playing for a chance to make it to their home town to the final four...they were jacked.

EDIT: Kansas
Syracuse
Kansas State
Villanova
Duke
Ohio State
Michigan State
West Virginia
Kentucky

which of those teams would you put Butler ahead of jw.

Are you letting the names on the front of the jersey effect your thinking.

They beat MSU and lost to Duke in a nail biter so are you really serious? Where's UNI on that list? Villanova? They did absolutely nothing the last 1/2 of the season. So to answer your question I'd put Butler ahead of every team except Duke.

 

[amckillip]

playing one game in the tournament and winning doesn't prove anything...playing for a chance to make it to their home town to the final four...they were jacked.

EDIT: Kansas
Syracuse
Kansas State
Villanova
Duke
Ohio State
Michigan State
West Virginia
Kentucky

which of those teams would you put Butler ahead of jw.

All of them except MSU and Duke. What exactly has Kentucky done recently? or Villanova? Look at teams not jerseys.

 

[Future Walk-On]

All of them except MSU and Duke. What exactly has Kentucky done recently? or Villanova? Look at teams not jerseys.

yeah Butler had success.....they got hot at the right time (although they had been hot already rolling through horizon league play). you can't tell me Butler was the 2nd best team in the nation.....that is ridiculous.....

you can't tell me UNI was better than Kansas...........

EDIT: I am saying over the course of the entire season Butler didn't prove themselves to be better than any of those teams. They beat some teams in one game. They got hot at the right time. I couldn't see that happening again.

 

[amckillip]

yeah Butler had success.....they got hot at the right time (although they had been hot already rolling through horizon league play). you can't tell me Butler was the 2nd best team in the nation.....that is ridiculous.....

you can't tell me UNI was better than Kansas...........

Who was better than Butler?? I can tell you that, they won. Kansas consistently underachieves. Kentucky hasn't done anything lately, the last time Villanova was in the Final Four was the same time a George Mason was there and BU was in the sweet sixteen. I'm not sure Butler was the 2nd best team in the nation, I think they might have been #1. Why is it so hard to conceive Butler, a pre-season #9 team wasn't a top tier team at the end of the season? Do we only judge by the provedly flawed recruit rating system that is completely based on the name of the school a kid attends? Or by the number of McDonalds All-Americans, so was UNC the best team last year? How would you determine who the best team is? The infamous eye-test?

I'll put it this way, if you were to work for me, and you look good doing something, but don't get results, you're gone. You look ugly but accomplish your goals? You get promoted.

 

[Future Walk-On]

Who was better than Butler?? I can tell you that, they won. Kansas consistently underachieves. Kentucky hasn't done anything lately, the last time Villanova was in the Final Four was the same time a George Mason was there and BU was in the sweet sixteen. I'm not sure Butler was the 2nd best team in the nation, I think they might have been #1. Why is it so hard to conceive Butler, a pre-season #9 team wasn't a top tier team at the end of the season?

I agree they were a top tier team....but if they were supposed to be winning the national title game.....then none of their run would have been a big surprise....which it seemed to be

 

[amckillip]

I agree they were a top tier team....but if they were supposed to be winning the national title game.....then none of their run would have been a big surprise....which it seemed to be

Only to the biased media and selection committee. Top 10 ranked teams rarely find it hard to believe they're good.

 

[Future Walk-On]

Only to the biased media and selection committee. Top 10 ranked teams rarely find it hard to believe they're good.

Butler's best win outside the tournament was OSU at home without Evan Turner playing. They had 0 road wins outside the horizon league (besides northwestern without Coble and Ryan, and Evansville)

They beat Syracuse without Onaku and Michigan St. w/o Lucas.....they did beat Kansas state and played Duke tough....

They were surely not the 2nd best team in the nation or first.

 

[amckillip]

Butler's best win outside the tournament was OSU at home without Evan Turner playing. They had 0 road wins outside the horizon league (besides northwestern without Coble and Ryan, and Evansville)

They beat Syracuse without Onaku and Michigan St. w/o Lucas.....they did beat Kansas state and played Duke tough....

They were surely not the 2nd best team in the nation or first.

Excuses if you want, but Butler beat OSU, MSU, Syracuse, and K-State. Show me a team with a MORE impressive set of non-con victories. Include the NCAA tourney. Go look at Kansas' Non-con, or Syracuse's they have a worse non-con schedule by far.

BTW Butlers non-con schedule SOS: 1 (as in toughest in the nation). Bottom line, by any objective measure, Butler was better than any team in the country save Duke. By the subjective measures, they finished #2 and #3 (by the media and coaches whose opinion you seem to so highly value).

 

[TheAsianSensation]

Go look at Kansas' Non-con, or Syracuse's they have a worse non-con schedule by far.

Syracuse #14 non-con SoS, Kansas #30 according to what I see. For what it's worth.

And technically Butler was #2 non-con SoS, behind California, but obviously that doesn't change the argument you have.

Can't we agree that Butler was a top-10 team from last year, and that it's not any stretch to think any top-10 team can get to a championship game without "overachieving"?

 

[Future Walk-On]

Excuses if you want, but Butler beat OSU, MSU, Syracuse, and K-State. Show me a team with a MORE impressive set of non-con victories. Include the NCAA tourney. Go look at Kansas' Non-con, or Syracuse's they have a worse non-con schedule by far.

BTW Butlers non-con schedule SOS: 1 (as in toughest in the nation). Bottom line, by any objective measure, Butler was better than any team in the country save Duke. By the subjective measures, they finished #2 and #3 (by the media and coaches whose opinion you seem to so highly value).

I don't see this as awesome.

DAV W 73-62
11/18 @ NW W 67-54
11/21 @ EVAN W 64-60
11/26 vs. MINN L 82-73
11/27 vs. UCLA W 69-67
11/29 vs. CLEM L 70-69
12/02 @ BALL W 59-38
12/05 VALP W 84-67
12/08 vs. GTWN L 72-65
12/12 OSU W 74-66
12/19 XAV W 69-68
Lost at UAB by 10 too

going by just the NCAA tourney...and beating teams not at full strength....yeah they obv. were the 2nd best team in the country.

 

[amckillip]

I don't see this as awesome.

DAV W 73-62
11/18 @ NW W 67-54
11/21 @ EVAN W 64-60
11/26 vs. MINN L 82-73
11/27 vs. UCLA W 69-67
11/29 vs. CLEM L 70-69
12/02 @ BALL W 59-38
12/05 VALP W 84-67
12/08 vs. GTWN L 72-65
12/12 OSU W 74-66
12/19 XAV W 69-68
Lost at UAB by 10 too

going by just the NCAA tourney...and beating teams not at full strength....yeah they obv. were the 2nd best team in the country.

Yeah, you're right, every objective measure is wrong. SOS, the tournament, etc. Only your subjective opinion can determine if someones good, ignore results. I'll say it AGAIN. Show me one of these teams your saying is so good that had a better non-con schedule.

 

[Future Walk-On]

Yeah, you're right, every objective measure is wrong. SOS, the tournament, etc. Only your subjective opinion can determine if someones good, ignore results. I'll say it AGAIN. Show me one of these teams your saying is so good that had a better non-con schedule.

If Butler had the number 1 non-con then that is impossible. They also didn't run through their non con.....look at it....

why are we limiting this to better noncon schedule? i was using butlers noncon because their league is bad. all the teams i named battled through teams at butlers caliber or better in their respective leagues........

 

[SFP]

If Butler had the number 1 non-con then that is impossible. They also didn't run through their non con.....look at it....

why are we limiting this to better noncon schedule? i was using butlers noncon because their league is bad. all the teams i named battled through teams at butlers caliber or better in their respective leagues........

Just maybe those other conferences were just not as good as the pundits would have it. The Big East save WVU had a horrible NCAA Tourney!:-o

 

[amckillip]

Just maybe those other conferences were just not as good as the pundits would have it. The Big East save WVU had a horrible NCAA Tourney!:-o

Exactly, this thought that all those other teams were as good are better than Butler is a joke. How could they have been? The 'best; conferences had terrible showings. Look how well the Big 12 and Big East fared when it mattered... Butler was and is a top team, and will likely be again this year. The assumption these teams were better because they come from the conferences they did is not logical. If Butler played BCS football we'd be touting them as a top 5 basketball team next year.